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Traded for a 1916 Simson and Co. bolt MM (mostly) Imperial Gew98

plymouthmauser

Senior Member
Houston, we have a new Gew98.

I traded my Romanian scrubbed bolt MM DOT44 K98k plus $200 for this mostly bolt MM 1916 Simson & Co. WWI Gew98. Here are the 'before' pics as it came home; I have not taken it down yet.

The good: Serial 1246e matching parts: stock, butt plate, barrel, receiver. ejector box, both bands, both trigger screws, and good bore

The bad: stock varnished, I think, but not sanded, I think. Trigger guard, floor plate, and follower do not match the action and each other, but are Imperial proofed. Front capture screw broken off. Cocking piece frozen to firing pin. Bolt body, cocking piece and shroud do not match action and each other, but Imperial proofed. WB carved into butt stock; M/E/W carved into stock. The funky, useless sling held on by a nail has been removed.:facepalm:

So how did I do? :)

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PM
 
gew98

Looks good. I'd say it was an up-grade. The sloppy varnish job was a gift in an accident. It protected the metal. Dissassemble the rifle and buy a gallon of laqure thinner and clean all the parts. This will eat that crap off. Also the broken t.g. locking screw may come out. It will probably stick out on the inside. Just enough to grab. Use kroil to soak it first. Walnut strips well and I have no issues stripping walnut stocks.
Then refinish it. That will make the rifle look 10x better..
 
Barrel Code

Got the action out of the stock; took a while, it was varnished together. A little penetrating oil got them apart. I oiled the stub of the capture screw and hope it comes out later.

Capture screw stump removed from the inside. Cocking piece still frozen.

Here is the barrel code:



PM
 

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All done and back together. I managed to remove the stump of the capture screw. Unfortunately only the top half of the ejector box screw came out; I'll have to order one from Numrich. I'll also order a sling and cleaning rod from Liberty Tree next week. I have stripped the stock of varnish, added two coats of cut Tung oil, and waxed afterwards. Stock does seem sanded as wood is very smooth and cartouches are light. Wood is a very light golden color; I wonder if it is Beech and not walnut - I've never seen walnut this light. All parts match except bolt body, bolt shroud, cocking piece, follower, trigger, trigger guard, and floor plate. These parts have mixed serial numbers, but all have Imperial proofs. I have replaced the capture screw with an original, and replaced one rear swivel screw with an original - one was a flat head sheet metal screw. The cocking piece is still frozen to the bolt; it is soaking overnight in CLP. Rifle is not import marked. I'll have finished pics tomorrow in daylight with the bolt back in; separated or not.

PM
 
Very nice barrel! Krupp blank and has the alpha character after the lot 10 "c" (not sure why Simson's have these, but many do).

As I said on Gunboards, a tough rifle to find, took some real wheeling and dealing to get my 1916 Simson in a trade. It is an "a" block and all matching/original, but has been used a bunch!

My 1917 Simson is a blot m/m too but stock is unsanded. Use to belong to BruceK years ago, need to upgrade it, but a nicer one would cost a mini-fortune.

The toughest years for Simson is 1915 bigtime (only one known, though others are "reported") and 1918 are damn tough but several are known. 1916 & 1917 are much easier to find but not easy.

Bummer is all the ones I own are 1916 & 1917.
 
stock

Hey PM, the stock is Walnut for sure. Beech has small little lighter flecks of color in the wood. It has been lightly sanded but, there is not much you can do now. Steaming the stock might raise the grain a bit but, since you already treated it I'd say its to late.
So did you grab that local???? I havent been to A.A. lately..
 
Wayne,

I described the find in the NES forum. I had emailed the g-broker seller of the matching CG Haenel 98M, as it turned out he was in Sturbridge. "I asked if it was for sale locally" but he said no. He also said he had another Gew98 in WWI trim - this one.

The kicker is I could have walked out of the store with the CG Haenel before it went to auction for $450. It sold for $2226.

This one was $475, marked down to $425, and $225 trade for my "Quandary" Romanian scrub bolt MM DOT44, left me to pay $226 with tax in cash.

Tim

PS: Cocking piece is still frozen after a night in CLP. I did get it to turm 1mm with wrapped pliers, but a very awkward problem.

PPS: boly body, extractor, trigger and sear match '53' with a weird proof; a 4-bladed propeller in a circle. Cocking piece '27', floor plate '26', trigger guard is '7481'.
 
98's

That type of selling price will keep him from selling anything in his store again. Another reason gun-shows and military shows are a former shadow of themselves. Internetitis is what we have to deal with. The only down fall is nobody gets out and interacts anymore with real people. We only know a screen name. Most gun shop owners have no idea what some collectors are willing to pay for a certain 98. Just a code or a name can mean small bucks to big bucks fast... I did'nt see the other auction so I have no idea
how nice it was..
 
98

A nice rifle and looks to all matching and correct. I can't see it being worth the selling price but, who am I to say what someone else spends on stuff. The simson is more scarce but the m.m. parts really hurt the value. I cant figure out at times the up and down scale of price. Anyway glad to see you were able to add the human aspect to you're purchace and now have another friend in the world. It's always worth the effort!!
 
The CGH isn't a Gew.98M, - it looks righteous Imperial and original, -from what he shows.

CGH is a tough maker, as are all the Suhl consortium rifles, in "matching-original" trim. They are not rare or even scarce in m/m condition but matching & original they can be darn difficult. MarkW once told me that S&S (Sauer) was one of the scarcest rifles to find matching & original.

Few have been around longer than Mark.. I will say that I have seen more matching-original S&S than either CGH or VCS, but none are common or easy to find.

Imo, maker rarity is Simson, VCS, CGH, S&S, WOK (some think WOK v.rare, but I have well over 100 trended- which is more than any of the Suhl firms), and arsenals are all big producers, with hundreds trended each, with Danzig far & away the leader. (Spandau has a lot too but many are not Spandau made).

Erfurt is the biggest Modell98 maker by far (Kar98a), but their Gew.98's are as scarce as the Suhl firms, many are sterngewehrs or obviously off-standard production. MO & DWM are up with the arsenals, rightfully so as the Modell98 belonged to them.

Of course condition rarity is a whole other story. I have not trended condition rarity, but most "Imperial" matching-original, non-rework is fairly tough to find these days.

That is why the CGH went total stupid.. try and find another.. Not too easy to find one someone will sell you- trade maybe, but nice rifles you generally have to trade for to shake loose from serious collectors.
 
Yes, WOK is easier than typing out Waffenwerke Oberspree Kornbusch & Co. and the name changes in 1918 dropping off Kornbusch (once DWM buys out the givernment partnership- which was a farce, as their participation was stealing DWM owned FN equipment.. typical givernment, they rob you with one hand and slap you around with the other.)

Anyway, nice WOK are tough to find, and the first $2k Gew.98's I ever saw (sold for $2k on auction, breaking a barrier many of us thought ridiculous) was a WOK, a 1917 I think- really nice but $2k "was" a lot of money for a wartime Gew.98
 
Weird EWB?

Sim,

You don't the carvings on my stock are a weird version on EWB do you?

PM
 

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No, I doubt they are German. To answer your value question, hard to say, $400-600 though you might be able to sell it for slightly more. Stock really hurts its value to many collectors.

Imo of course.
 

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