Third Party Press

Dual Coded RG34 Cleaning kit

agentcq

Senior Member
I was at a gun show last weekend and picked up this RG34 cleaning kit for $10.00

I didn't think much of it at the time, painted RG34 cleaning kit marked 'ab44'. It wasn't till I got home that I noticed a few strange things about the kit.

1. One lid marked ab 44
2. One lid marked CXN
3. Missing closing snaps (but after inspecting the inside of the can, it appears that it never had closing snaps as there is no sign of any soldering on the inside of the tin

Do you think that this was put together with left over parts post war?

Or was it a Kriegsmodell cleaning kit that had shortcuts and was made from left over parts?

Sadly the cleaning kit was empty so the contents are not going to help identify its history.
 

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It's pretty easy to swap lids on these cans, so it may have been a repair since both codes are different companies. If it would have been an earlier version of the code (such as a G Appel door with cnx) I would believe it. A similar can was reported on Waf Awards recently.
 
Hello,
first an overview of production:
Gustav Appel:
G.Appel 1935 - 1938, in late 1938/39 Appel introduced the "64" code. Probably around 1941 they changed code to "cnx". lower case letters!
No Appel (64/cnx) made cleaning kit has a reinforcing fin.

Mundlos:
Mundlos 1935 - 1940. 1940 - 1944 code "ab"
No "ab45" coded cleaning kit has shown up so far.
In 1940/41 Mundlos introduced the one piece reinforcing fin. (like Hawig/"cmr")
In ~1942 the divided reinforcing fin was introduced.
The Mundlos factory was heavily bombed in January 1945.

The "CNX" (upper case letters) kits always have the divided reinforcing fin and sometimes the WaA20 acceptance stamp attributed to the Appel company.
I very much doubt that Appel changed its machinery and introduced the divided reinforing fin in late 1944/early 1945.
But rather, Appel assembled cleaning kits from left over parts of the destroyed Mundlos company.
To clarify that these cleaning kits were only assembled at Appel, they changed their code from the lower to the upper case letters for these kits.

This only is an assumption!
But if you want to get rid of your dual marked kit, please drop me a line.

Concerning the missing closing snaps: Most "cmr45" marked kits I've seen, do not have the closing snaps. => late war shortcuts

Wolf
 
Last edited:
I was at a gun show last weekend and picked up this RG34 cleaning kit for $10.00

I didn't think much of it at the time, painted RG34 cleaning kit marked 'ab44'. It wasn't till I got home that I noticed a few strange things about the kit.

1. One lid marked ab 44
2. One lid marked CXN
3. Missing closing snaps (but after inspecting the inside of the can, it appears that it never had closing snaps as there is no sign of any soldering on the inside of the tin

Do you think that this was put together with left over parts post war?

Or was it a Kriegsmodell cleaning kit that had shortcuts and was made from left over parts?

Sadly the cleaning kit was empty so the contents are not going to help identify its history.


What an outstanding extremely late war last ditch rg34 cleaning kit can! Sorry that this is an old post I am digging back up but I am a recent member here and playing catch-up. This is one of only a very small handful of rg34 cans that I have ever encountered in this configuration. And this should say something about their scarcity as I have several thousand examples recorded in databased spread sheets compiled during research over many years. In my opinion these cans are 100% original and last ditch wartime examples. I personally own one can that is marked exactly like this piece and of the same construction to include the lack of closure clips and instead exhibiting the inward bent lip of the lid. A second can in my collection is exactly the same except it has one lid marked CNX and one stamped ab43 WaA20. I have no problem with these cans as late war last ditch example made from pieces and components from the abandoned Mundlos factory and finished, assembled, or reassembled by another firm, most probably Gustav Appel. Wolfgang (Amberg) provides greater detail regarding this theory in his excellent post above.

One word of caution regarding the assertion in #3 above that "it never had closing snaps as there is no sign of any soldering on the inside of the tin" - All of the rg34 producers had ceased using silver solder by 1940, most even earlier. Some firms substituted spot or tack welds to hold internal dividers, floor plates, and hinge pins in place. Others producers including Mundlos (who by all appearances made the can above) did not tack, spot weld or solder these pins in place. Rather the ridged and grooved construction of the can itself was designed to hold the lids and closure clips securely in place. The same can be said for the series of ribs or ridges to the body of the can which serve to hold the internal component divider as well as the patch compartment floor plate in place. To simplify what I am trying to say, the lack of solder does not mean that there was never a hinge pin or closure clip.

My thoughts only - Lance O. Adams .....
 
It's pretty easy to swap lids on these cans, so it may have been a repair since both codes are different companies. If it would have been an earlier version of the code (such as a G Appel door with cnx) I would believe it. A similar can was reported on Waf Awards recently.


mrfarb et al,

Dual marked rg34 cans are scarce but they are encountered with some frequency. As you indicated most often they are examples from the same maker with different dates or name/code changes again involving the same maker. One would suspect that these dual markings were a result of using old maker marked or dated stock. Reported examples include:

- G. Appel/64
- 64/cnx

- arr4/rco44

- Mundlos 1940/ab40
- ab43/1b44

- ab43/CNX
- ab44/CNX

I would be surprised if there war not others as well.

Lance ......
 
Hello, first an overview of production:

Gustav Appel:
G.Appel 1935 - 1938, in late 1938/39 Appel introduced the "64" code. Probably around 1941 they changed code to "cnx". lower case letters!
No Appel (64/cnx) made cleaning kit has a reinforcing fin.

Mundlos:
Mundlos 1935 - 1940. 1940 - 1944 code "ab"
No "ab45" coded cleaning kit has shown up so far.
In 1940/41 Mundlos introduced the one piece reinforcing fin. (like Hawig/"cmr")
In ~1942 the divided reinforcing fin was introduced.
The Mundlos factory was heavily bombed in January 1945.

The "CNX" (upper case letters) kits always have the divided reinforcing fin and sometimes the WaA20 acceptance stamp attributed to the Appel company. I very much doubt that Appel changed its machinery and introduced the divided reinforing fin in late 1944/early 1945. But rather, Appel assembled cleaning kits from left over parts of the destroyed Mundlos company. To clarify that these cleaning kits were only assembled at Appel, they changed their code from the lower to the upper case letters for these kits.

This only is an assumption!

But if you want to get rid of your dual marked kit, please drop me a line.

Concerning the missing closing snaps: Most "cmr45" marked kits I've seen, do not have the closing snaps. => late war shortcuts

Wolf


Sorry to post three times in this same older thread but think some additional comments may add value. First of all, I have an enormous respect for Wolfgang and his research/knowledge regarding the Reinigungsgeräte34. He has contributed immensely and unselfishly to the data and details that I have collected. Although our terminology is different and we may not agree in opinions regarding some small points I concur with his statements above. That said, I wanted to add just a couple of comments that may help clarify some of the details and also strengthen our theories regarding the CNX marked rg34 cans. To use his format as above:


Gustav Appel:

- The cnx stamping used by Appel is in a small squat thick letter lower case font.

- The cnx stamping appearing on Appel rg34 kits will be on the left side of the lid. *1

- Painted G. Appel made rg34 cans whether marked 64 or cnx will always have painted closure clips.

- G. Appel utilized the Stick Wing Eagle WaA20 inspection stamping/proof marking.


Mundlos:

- The maker name or ab code on Mundlos rg34 kits will be on the right side of the lid.

- Painted Mundlos made rg34 cans whether marked Mundlos or ab will exhibit blued steel (never painted) closure clips. *2


CNX marked (suspected Mundlos parts, pieces, and components finished by Appel):

- The CNX stamping used on these rg34 cans is in large tall thin letter upper case font.

- The CNX stamping appearing on these rg34 kits will be on the right side of the lid.

- CNX marked rg34 cans will exhibit blued steel (never painted) closure clips.

- Some CNX marked rg34 cans were completed without closure clips, instead having inward bent lid lips that hold the lid closed.

- Some CNX marked rg34 cans (approximately 60% of recorded examples) utilize the Stick Wing Eagle WaA20 inspection/proof marking. *3


*1 - One very rare example G. Appel made rg34 can has been recorded with the cnx stamping on the right side of the lid.

*2 - A few early painted Mundlos and ab marked rg34 cans are recorded with brass closure clips (probably old stock from silver tinned kits).

*3 - Stick Wing Eagle WaA20 inspection/proof markings are also found on Braunschweigische Blechwarenfabrik GmbH (some arr43 & arr4) rg34 cans.


Hope this helps - Lance O. Adams .....
 

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