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EWB rifles and reworks

George R.

Well-known member
I have been researching these EWB gewehrs and the rework or reissue under the nazi's, when keeping the standard gew bbl I am under the impression that they were just reissued ( what markings or proofs where are they proofed ) are they still numbered externally with new numbers or the old numbers, the WW1 rifles were in the white recievers and bolts I believe the reissues are blued ?? Steer me in the right direction. any help greatly appreciated. Thanks George
 
I am not sure I understand the question fully but the basics:

EWB, "1920 property marked" and rework (depot markings) are unrelated to one another. They are 3 unrelated markings and all can exist on a rifle independently.

EWB marked rifles often are straight up Imperial in configuration, the rifles were simply supplied to the Bavarian Einwohnerwehr. Which was basically a militia organized to retain order, and it (the Einwohnerwehr) existed throughout Germany, but lasted longer in Bavaria. It was not a Freikorps or police organization and it was not always "conservative" in perspective- generally it took on the nature of where the militia was organized, which as communists were causing so much trouble they were usually conservative. The EWB was eventually disbanded and some of the rifles found their way back into the Reichsheer, but some apparently found their way into hidden caches (Röhm was an arms smuggler and he was involved with the arming of the EWB). I have owned two EWB never upgraded and seen others.

"1920" marking is a property marking, and means it was in government hands during the disarming act. It means nothing else, and was used in a short time frame during which the German government tried to disarm the German people of "military" arms, largely due to British and French pressure (Spa conference- or rather the "Spa lecture", as the Germans were rarely involved in discussions, at least before 1925-26, - they were interrogated and lectured at best)

Reworks, - most rifles that stayed in German hands ("1920" property marked rifles and black rifles) were at least upgraded to S/sS patrone compliant, and most to sS patrone (1929 or later). Further many were reworked at the depots, with new Simson barrels, or actually reworked at Simson Suhl (very few). Most rifles that were upgraded were also blued; receivers and bolts, and often the stocks were sanded lightly. There are many differences, some subtle.

Whether just upgraded or fully reworked they should have depot markings, usually at the wrist, but sometimes on the bottom of the buttstock or sides. Very rarely on the buttplate or take down disc (this is either for the parts mfg or the acceptance of the facility that performed the installing, depends how it is marked).

This topic, depot work (whether upgrades, reworks or depot builds) is rather limited in published material, MarkW did some good early work in the KCN, JoeS & I have written on it in the MRJ, but the subject is very diverse.

Be more specific? Have you a rifle in mind? If so describe it.

I have been researching these EWB gewehrs and the rework or reissue under the nazi's, when keeping the standard gew bbl I am under the impression that they were just reissued ( what markings or proofs where are they proofed ) are they still numbered externally with new numbers or the old numbers, the WW1 rifles were in the white recievers and bolts I believe the reissues are blued ?? Steer me in the right direction. any help greatly appreciated. Thanks George
 
Paul,
here is all the info on the rifle I picked up at estate auction, I believe that the stock was sanded at the time of repair and not a bubba job, the handguard matches and is untouched. My opinion is that this rifle was rebuilt a few times. The bbl has a 37 proofs on it along with a .2 mark on the collar, bbl code is pictured. Most numbers were forced matched but only two of them as you can see in pic. There is a rework mark on wrist of what looks like a 2 over XX the stock was renumbered to match on the outside. Never seen one before so this is new to me.

GR
 

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more pics set 2
 

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more pics set 3 the impact on the side of the rifle must have been great enough to warrant a new bbl, one helluva big chunk.
 

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George, while you do not show it, yet, I suspect this is a leftover receiver and was never assembled before this barrel being applied to it. Do a right receiver shot and if it has only one acceptance, or two maybe, then it was never build during the war.

In regular production acceptance is everything.

The barrel is a 1939'ish JP Sauer barrel, and that probably dates the original build, though one can only guess because depots were prone to do things their own way with little marking outside of the stock, - if it went through a depot more than once it probably will be marked in the stock (this of course assumes the stock wasn't replaced subsequently)

Many 1916 dated Spandau's (mostly sub-contract receivers), even more 1917 Spandau receivers, and almost all 1918 Spandau receivers were never build during the war. Spandau got out of the rifle business in 1917 and it is hard to find one made by them that year and after, some of the receivers were diverted to Hannover (H receivers- assumed Hannover, but no proof), many to Danzig, and a few to Mauser for assembly but relatively few are Spandau assembled.

Do more images if you can, if this stock is EWB marked it was salvaged as I doubt this rifle was built in 1919-1921.
 
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Are there depot markings on the actual stock, at the wrist, on the buttstock? The band markings are just the maker of the parts. HZa Spandau made lots of these parts, they even finished barrels.

Look at the receiver on the bottom, and look for a sub-contractor logo? Image the right receiver?

Lacking a fireproof on the receiver, only on the barrel (and its style), and how it is marked leads me to believe this receiver was not built pre-war or very early in the war.
 
Paul, it has a single proof on the right side of reciever, imperial marked. The bottom of reciever has all kinds of strange marks, I'll get some pics of bottom tomorrow. Their are alot of small stampings on the wrist one on the right side before stock disc, I cannot make it out.
 
here are the rest of the pics from the bottom and right side reciever, the small marks on the wrist are mostly gone to time, the only real prevelant stamp is the 2/xx or it maybe a 2/W their also is a small what I think is a e/37 in front of stock disc ( using magnifying glass I can make out a 3 or 8 and a 7 kind if narrows down I think). I do not understand the rest of the markings. What exactly would you consider this rifle a G98 or new made/salvage rifle by Sauer, would it have gone to second line troops I like just never seen anything like it. This has been a strange year for rifles. GR
 

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The receiver was made by Siemans & Halske, Berlin, supposedly for Spandau, but not many were used by them. Most show up on Hannover builds and postwar builds. I wrote a small piece in the MRJ some time back, a year or two maybe, on S&H, and they made all sorts of war material in WWI, grenades, MG's and other related items.

I doubt JP Sauer had much to do with the rifle, as they being a commercial firm would not have been very enthusiastic about salvaging and rebuilding rifles, and had they I would think they would have cycled the receiver through their system as a 98k, not an upgraded Gew.98. They would also have performed normal acceptance for the rifle, and if they serialed the receiver they should have f/p it too? (in 1944 they did drop rec. serialing but as I recall they still f/p the receiver- I have this trended and will check later..)

Most likely this was salvaged by a depot.

Yes, an upgraded Gew.98 would primarily have been issued to support troops, especially as the war progressed.

here are the rest of the pics from the bottom and right side reciever, the small marks on the wrist are mostly gone to time, the only real prevelant stamp is the 2/xx or it maybe a 2/W their also is a small what I think is a e/37 in front of stock disc ( using magnifying glass I can make out a 3 or 8 and a 7 kind if narrows down I think). I do not understand the rest of the markings. What exactly would you consider this rifle a G98 or new made/salvage rifle by Sauer, would it have gone to second line troops I like just never seen anything like it. This has been a strange year for rifles. GR
 
Paul thanks for all your help. Do you want bbl codes from WW1 rifles at all K98a matching not reworked VET BB 1915 Erfurt I believe as long as it is out I'll take it apart. GR
 
George, I collect data 1888-1945 for my trends work, and have an interest in the barrel coding and acceptance patterns for all rifles, whether factory original or rework (German rework).

I would like to see your rifles data, if it isn't inconvenient, thanks!

Paul thanks for all your help. Do you want bbl codes from WW1 rifles at all K98a matching not reworked VET BB 1915 Erfurt I believe as long as it is out I'll take it apart. GR
 
Paul no problem as long as it out of the safe I'll get it for you, no inconvience at all you more than help me out with my dumb questions. George
 
The bbl code off the Kar98 1916 ( I was wrong thought it was 1915 ) serial# 65xx i pic of bbl code attached. GR
 

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Erfurt is notorious for their lousy marking, many are worse than this one, which I think is B.S.I. (based upon others) and I do not know the steel firm it represents. It isn't Böhler, as Erfurt uses "BÖ" in 1915 & 1916 for them, and they used "BI" for Bismarckhütte. When I get to the point where I have enough to work up a solid trends sheet, I will figure who they are, as one of my main interests is German steel and machine tool firms.

Looks like it might be a nice rifle, you should consider showing her off?

1916 was the last year Erfurt did decent work, - they are much maligned (justifiably) for their lousy quality later in the war. However when you compare the range of products, their enormous efficiency, they were the most impressive of firms. They made all sorts of things, pistols and rifles to machineguns and supplied others with critical parts, - they were the top manufacturer of the Modell98, even surpassing Danzig! (who did little besides manufacturing the Gew.98)
 
Paul here she is nothing pretty my only one also have a bbl code for you AX 1940 303 39 Ru 4563 e/280 proofs i I had it out also for pics on g-boards. GR
 

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Beauty in women and rifles is overrated, sure they are nice to have, but man they sure aren't cheap and usually are a lot more trouble than they are worth.

You pay out the nose for them and can't enjoy them like you can one that has some experience.

When I was heavy into the Kar98a, I found a 1916 Erfurt (Imperial) quite difficult to find nice and original. Most had problems, something mismatched, sanded, chopped, or Weimar'ed, so this rifle is pretty nice imo!

What is the suffix on the ax/40? There is some overlap on ERMA's transition from 27 to ax, but usually in the "f" block they go to "ax", - I assume "303 39 Ru" is the BC? The "4563" is out of place or at least doesn't follow my trends work so far (the serial? The suffix?).

Do your contribution here too, here or the 98k side, as it is wasted over on Gunboards98k… really sad the way they have let that place go.

Paul here she is nothing pretty my only one also have a bbl code for you AX 1940 303 39 Ru 4563 e/280 proofs i I had it out also for pics on g-boards. GR
 
Paul I wholeheartedly agree the beauty thing is way over rated ( I have a redneck girl so I can relate ), you really nailed it on the head. on the AX the serial number is 4563 i I think it is pic stickied but not with all the shots I took today, I'll get ahold of Craig and have him add them if possible. I cannot get to my earlier rifles ( 98's and Wins ) as I do not keep all in one place, I have a bcd41 matching here and a duv 42 I think couple dozen other 98's, I'll start rumaging just do not get the time to take apart fulltime and a small business take up alot time.
 
George, I think I found it!

http://www.k98kforum.com/showthread.php?312-AX-1940-shrapnel-damaged

Sounds like you have a fine collection.

Paul I wholeheartedly agree the beauty thing is way over rated ( I have a redneck girl so I can relate ), you really nailed it on the head. on the AX the serial number is 4563 i I think it is pic stickied but not with all the shots I took today, I'll get ahold of Craig and have him add them if possible. I cannot get to my earlier rifles ( 98's and Wins ) as I do not keep all in one place, I have a bcd41 matching here and a duv 42 I think couple dozen other 98's, I'll start rumaging just do not get the time to take apart fulltime and a small business take up alot time.
 
Paul that is it I consider what I have a modest collection, I really like it when I get history with whatever I pick-up, been collecting this stuff for 25 years now, it turned out to be a great investment. I will pull some of the others apart for your studies and try to get some pics.
 

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