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Karab. 98b depot build help

JohnnieDavis

Junior Member
Karab. 98b depot build help..better pics added

Good evening all. I have a shot at picking up a k98b. I haven't seen it in person yet, only photos. Unfortunately I didn't take them and can't post them here. Anyway here it goes. It has matching reciever, barrel and floorplate. No details about the bolt. It may or may not be reblued as the B in karab 98b is hard to see in the photos. The stock appears to be a standard k98 without grasping grooves. The thing that threw me was the rear sight base was marked S42/G. How common would that be to have the S42/G marking with the correctly numbered barrel?

Thanks in advance, I know pictures would help but not possible right now.

JD
 
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I saw your post on Gunboards-98k, probably should have done it on Gunboards-Mauser, as this subject needs a specialist and you will not find one on Gunboards-98k. You might get some intelligent comments on Gunboards-Mauser though, TP's forum is still excellent for German military rifles.

As you state, without pictures or a detailed description there is only a limited amount of things one can say about your rifle. You mention bluing, it is impossible to judge whether the bluing is original without pictures, even with pictures it is problematic. A faded or weak "B" on the siderail isn't much to go on, the acceptance stamps and serial/fireproof would be at least as susceptible to any wear associated with re-bluing. Typically the acceptance show more fading than a siderail, though a weakly struck siderail is also possible.

An original 98b stock would have grips and a takedown. If it lacks them the stock is almost assured not original. There are some RM (naval) reworks that have G98 type stocks on them, meaning no side sling arrangements, but these are in a narrow range, and from recollection they have grips and takedown.

The "S/42G", I assume you mean the rearsight sleeve, the mount that wraps around the barrel and forms the foundation for the rearsight assembly, - the nomenclature varies by collector, generally, but usually this is called a RS sleeve, however, just the fact that any part of your RS is S/42G marked means it has been at a minimum replaced, probably a subsequent upgrade, which most 98b saw to one degree or another. Anyway, the presence of a S/42 RS part has no influence of whether the barrel is replaced, they are two different things (parts) and often RS parts are replaced. The markings on the barrel will determine whether its original or replaced, usually found under the stock.

Little can be said beyond this, you do not even give information to determine a range for the rifle, and Simson 98b production is broken down by variation (there is no formal chart, my break down differs from the one Mike used, but they generally follow a pattern based upon marking pattern changes), a type II (where the Karab.98b designation was introduced, a late a-block) through type 4 would all have the same siderail designation. Only the last block changed the SR...

The only clue given that gives some indication of a problem is the stock, you do not mention length, and a 98b should be the same length as a G98, and the stock sounds like it could be a 98k stock. Which is 6 inches shorter. This is not neccessarily a problem, it could be a conversion (not likely as they are rare) or they could be recycled 98b receiver built as a 98k, which is far more common. Or it could be a postwar rework or sporter rescue, or a great many things as well.

When you get it do some pictures and we should be able to help a great deal more. I would not waste time with Gunboards-98k, but posting about your rifle on Gunboards-Mauser might get a few knowledgeable comments.

Good evening all. I have a shot at picking up a k98b. I haven't seen it in person yet, only photos. Unfortunately I didn't take them and can't post them here. Anyway here it goes. It has matching reciever, barrel and floorplate. No details about the bolt. It may or may not be reblued as the B in karab 98b is hard to see in the photos. The stock appears to be a standard k98 without grasping grooves. The thing that threw me was the rear sight base was marked S42/G. How common would that be to have the S42/G marking with the correctly numbered barrel?

Thanks in advance, I know pictures would help but not possible right now.

JD
 
Well, my lousy connection and old pc can't handle photobucket, they are memory pirates that take over my computers memory... practically freezes it up. Anyway, got to a couple pictures, it looks like an Simson ordnance spare built into a rifle by a depot, not a 98b made at Simson. There are not especially common, but they rarely command high prices, though much of that is because most found are in pretty sorry shape.

Try and post pictures here and more can be said, but I am not going to photobucket ever again, damn hijackers...
 
Thank you, here they are uploaded here. I dislike photobucket, glad there is another option.

JD
 

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Interesting rifle you can clearly tell its been together for along time. The grime dirt mark where the receiver meets the stock shows it. Any stock markings by chance?
 
This rifle is a depot build, assembled from spare components into a rifle (as Loewe stated), but I have never been able to pin down the depot as all of the rifles from this depot seem to have butchered stocks to one degree or another, and that is where the clues lie to the rework facility. I know this because of the firing proof, it's very unique - I've only noted it on Gew.98 receiver based reworks, which is not a good indicator as there could be 98k receiver based rifles as well. It looks like the stock may be sanded, but if not can you see any markings in the wood?
 
Interesting rifle you can clearly tell its been together for along time. The grime dirt mark where the receiver meets the stock shows it. Any stock markings by chance?




Perhaps so, but someone had the bands off at least at some point to get the lower one reversed. Maybe stored in a basement or attic for a long time since though.
 
Agreed, definitely a depot build, - which one can only be identified by a close examination of the stock, look at the wrist, the underside of the buttstock and possibly on the sides of the buttstock, the marking can be (often is) very small and difficult to decipher.

I agree with the others that this looks original, for the most part together for a long time. Its potential for value entirely depends on identification of the ordnance depot that built it.

BTW, the barrel is an SDP (Steyr) made ordnance spare, a very common barrel supplier. Most of their ordnance spares were made 1938-1940, though this rifle probably dates to the early war period. Looks like a pretty nice depot rifle, these aren't too common full matching, if the bolt matches it would be a big plus.

If you like, Mike or I can move this to the 98k side of the forum, it isn't an 98b and it might get better attention there. Though Mike has seen it due to his post, some of the sharper specialists might not have and their input might be worthwhile.
 
If you can move it to get more attention, please do! I will be able to look at it better in person on Tuesday, so please stand by for further stock information. Assuming the bolt is correct, what would the value of something like this be? I know the depot ID is a variable, but assuming it's the most 'common' to rare, I would appreciate guidance.

JD
 
I've only noted it on Gew.98 receiver based reworks, which is not a good indicator as there could be 98k receiver based rifles as well.

I've seen it on Yugoslavian M1924 and I am pretty sure I've seen Polish/Czech rifles also.
 
Thank you all for your assistance. Got to look at it today, the bolt and screws match, as well as both bands. The stock looks to be straight from the depot, not sanded very finely but it is numbered to the rifle on the bottom, as well as a number 4 under the serial. No other markings on the stock.

Thank you.

JD
 
It's up for auction tonight..will know tonight! Any clue of value?

How was the bore? Its ruff but I would go to 700-1000 if it looks like it would clean up, less would be better. Interested in what others would say.

After looking again, its really ruff, it will clean up but not sure how well so you will need to make that call. Depot build rifles I do not know much about as far as value.
 
It's up for auction tonight..will know tonight! Any clue of value?

It could sell cheap but, value is subjective.. Also if they are online be ready for a battle with online bidders. Most guys would pay upwards of 1500+ for a complete matching example like that. All that closet rust will come off and it will look a thousand times better..


Also ; this is technically only a kar98b receiver re-used. This is a total k98k build at this point.
 
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It could sell cheap but, value is subjective.. Also if they are online be ready for a battle with online bidders. Most guys would pay upwards of 1500+ for a complete matching example like that. All that closet rust will come off and it will look a thousand times better..
I hate online bidders
went to an auction had a k98k 22 trainer. Looked nice but was mismatched. THat was not stated in the listing. Guy online out bid me probably didn't know it was mismatched and bid high on it.

If you do get it come here and ask how to clean it up. Don't do anything until you know it will not harm the rifles value.
 
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