Third Party Press

Lost weapons etc.

Stephan98k

aka 8x57IS
You've probably wondered what happened when a soldier lost his weapon, here is the answer to this question. As example for a lost K98k in 1944 the soldier had to pay 50 Reichsmark, a lot of money at that time.

Maybe somebody has a Soldbuch with such an entry and shows a picture of it.



Army Decree-Sheet published by the Army High Command

1066. Loss or damage to service equipment which had been used by killed in action or deceased members of the Wehrmacht.

In the case of loss or damage to clothing and equipment as well as to firearms, which had killed in action or deceased members of the Wehrmacht in official service use, a demand on the bereaved (heirless) for the compensation for lost value may not be carried out.

O.K.W., October 8, 1940
---- 2 f 32/Beih. 1 ---- WB (IX a).
 
Decree of the Army High Command.

543. Preservation of the weapons and the equipment.

A. In order to avoid intolerable loss of material, on August 8, 1944 the Chief of the Army General Staff ordered with directive Gen Qu/Abt. III/Qu 3 Nr. I/74900/44 g:

1. Anyone, whether an officer, an noncommissioned officer, a soldier, or a follower, who has his machine gun, his small arms, or his gas mask

a) lost,

b) careless left behind when wounded (the responsible doctors decide),

c) in the case of relocation to a new service place not in possession, is to be accountable.

2. For the loser not applicable regardless of the disciplinary or court martial penalty:

a) for a period of one year leave, exception: special leave in cases of death

b) the right to attribution of sales articles for soldiers of any kind, including tabaccos for the next 1/2 year.

3. Refunding must be made in any case. The following amounts must be paid:

for machine gun ............................................................... 120 R.M.
'' M. P. 44 ....................................................................... 80 ''
'' Rifle and machine pistol ................................................... 50 ''
'' Pistols .......................................................................... 30 ''
'' Gas mask ...................................................................... 20 ''

B. In addition is determined:

1. The following is to be entered on the last page of the Soldbuch:

"Lost of a machine gun at .......................................
vacation ban until .................................................."

2. The transcribe permission gives the battalion commander according to H. V. Bl. (Army Decree-Sheet) 1942 section B No. 931, he let check out the entry according to cipher 1.

3. The disposal of a "dutiful declaration" which has so far generally been common in the case of losses is no longer to be accepted.

4. This order is to be announced quarterly to all the soldiers and followers of the Field- and Replacement Army. The briefing has to get recorded.

O. K. H. (Ch H Rüst u. BdE), September 16, 1944
---- 41194/44 g ---- AHA/Stab I b 4.
 
Last edited:
I forgot to mention a official correction of the Decree of the Army High Command and the changes I marked in red color.

I hope these informations interests somebody.


643. Correction.

In the H. M. 1944 page 297 No. 543 there is to write:
In the title: “Preservation of the weapons and the equipment” (instead of
“reimbursement”), in paragraph 3, 4. line:
“M. P. 44” (instead of M. G. 42).

O. K. H., Obtober 20, 1944
---- 3362 b ---- Gen St d H/Gen Qu/Abt. III/Qu 3/WuG/Z.
 
Loss of leave for a year. Guess that didn't really matter all that much in the end. Can't imagine being wounded in combat and then penalized for leaving your weapon behind! And I've never understood the German army obsession with the gas mask. But I suspect that's my own ignorance. Did they have some use besides the risk of chemical warfare? I think I even read somewhere that they inspected the cans to be sure the troops were not emptying them and carrying other things in there?
 
Loss of leave for a year. Guess that didn't really matter all that much in the end. Can't imagine being wounded in combat and then penalized for leaving your weapon behind! And I've never understood the German army obsession with the gas mask. But I suspect that's my own ignorance. Did they have some use besides the risk of chemical warfare? I think I even read somewhere that they inspected the cans to be sure the troops were not emptying them and carrying other things in there?

That's right, they inspected the cans to be sure the troops were not emptying them and carrying other things in there. The other equipment got inspected too and a good example is the ammunition pouch for the same reason. There is a Army High Command order about this topic from 1942.

A comrade of mine died during his service and before his funeral his equipment got inspected. Two army shirts was missing, they was writing a notification of loss and his parents should pay the shirts. I was ripping the notification of loss and put my own shirts in his bag to avoid this bulls..t.
 
Yes, this is definitely useful and interesting, at least to me! Thanks for sharing it :thumbsup:

A comrade of mine died during his service and before his funeral his equipment got inspected. Two army shirts was missing, they was writing a notification of loss and his parents should pay the shirts. I was ripping the notification of loss and put my own shirts in his bag to avoid this bulls..t.

Good for you. The myopic view(s) of some organizations never cease to disgust me.

Pat
 
Great information provided thank you 8x57. And I understood the obsession with the gas mask after dealing with chemical warfare in the first world war all sides were obsessed with it. There was always that fear of it being released again. I'm glad the Germans didn't use it at the end of the war as an act of desperation.
 
Awesome write up thanks Stephen.

How nice of them in the first post, if he does he’s off the hook. Lol.
 
Very interesting. You had to just screw up to get such a fine by the US and even then you might get off. If wounded, forget it. They will find it most likely and recycle the rifle anyway.
 
Now, that is harsh discipline.

I'll second that!

If they'd do that for a rifle, regardless if you were wound.......I honestly can't even think what they'd do if you were a tanker and your tank became mechanically disabled, forcing you to abandon it.
 
I'll second that!

If they'd do that for a rifle, regardless if you were wound.......I honestly can't even think what they'd do if you were a tanker and your tank became mechanically disabled, forcing you to abandon it.

I read a book a few years back by a Polish man drafted into the red army in 1942 or so. He got the tank stuck while crossing a creek. This, coupled with his comments about his homesickness got him a death sentence. Killing your own soldiers for shite like this baffles me, but however. They won the war I guess.
 
You are very welcome!

The next one has nothing to do with lost weapons, nevertheless I want to share this one with you: It's forbidden to take hand grenades on recovery vacation. :facepalm:


Taking weapons with you on vacation.


There is reason to point out that it's forbidden to take service weapons, cartridges, hand grenades or other explosive devices on r e c o v e r y - v a c a t i o n.

The instruction of the H. Dv. 2 Section 14 Number 13, army-owned firearms must be turn in b e f o r e the v a c a t i o n, is hereby recalled.

O.K.H. (Ch H Rüst u. BdE), November 28, 1940
14 h 10 AHA /Ag/H (I d).
23532/40
 
I read a book a few years back by a Polish man drafted into the red army in 1942 or so. He got the tank stuck while crossing a creek. This, coupled with his comments about his homesickness got him a death sentence. Killing your own soldiers for shite like this baffles me, but however. They won the war I guess.

My wife's grandfather was in the red army, he got wounded and woke up in a German hospital. After the war the Soviet govt arrested him, said he didn't fight hard enough and put him in jail for 10yrs.:facepalm:
 
Accountability in all armies sometimes borders on the absurd....


I retired soon after the Gulf War ended. I listed all my equipment lost / damaged during the war as "LOST / DAMAGED DURING COMBAT OPERATIONS" and had the Bn XO sign off on it,

I forgot to list my poncho and had to pay for it, in cash, before I could retire,
 
My wife's grandfather was in the red army, he got wounded and woke up in a German hospital. After the war the Soviet govt arrested him, said he didn't fight hard enough and put him in jail for 10yrs.:facepalm:


He is lucky to be alive. If you look at the casualty figures of Soviets taken prisoner by the Germans, you would be horrified. Over the course of the whole war it was higher than 50%. In the early part of the war, I want to say that it was well over 90%. Then there are the death rates in the Gulags out east. Germans in Soviet hands didn't fair very well, but at least they weren't imprisoned when they made it back to Germany, barring of course war crimes issues.
 

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