Have an opportunity to buy a BSW DSM34 and a Gustloff KKW, Thoughts?

My problem is I have been looking for both a BSW and a Gustloff-Werke for a while, but don’t want to make an impulse purchase (has happened before and I regretted it).

Both are at an auction and as we all know auction pictures tend not to be that great. I always like to see rifles in person to a more informed decision., but I just live too far away. Taking into account the picture quality, both look like they are in good condition. Note where the top of the bolt stem hits the receiver on the Gustloff vs the BSW. In comparison the Gustloff doesn’t seem to have much wear. Also, the top BSW hand guard might be cracked a little.

I’ve tried to compile a valuation, but can’t seem to come up with a significant estimate. Information is limited on price and tends to vary significantly on condition and year of purchase. Any help in determining valuations based on the information I have and generally what they currently go for would be greatly appreciated.

I did edit the pictures slightly in Photoshop to add better contrast, sharpness, exposure, and bring out more detail from the "shadows". The color from the original has not been altered significantly Images posted below:

Bsw

Pictures of the BSW-DSM34

Gustloff KKW

Gustlof KKW

Do the numbers on the bolts match the numbers on the barrel/receiver. The BSW will be marked on the bottom of the bolt flat and the KKW will have the last three digits electro penciled on the top of the bolt flat. I have not seen numbers on the side of the stock before, on the BSW-DSM. Maybe others can give their opinion on them.

KKW22cal said:

Do the numbers on the bolts match the numbers on the barrel/receiver. The BSW will be marked on the bottom of the bolt flat and the KKW will have the last three digits electro penciled on the top of the bolt flat. I have not seen numbers on the side of the stock before, on the BSW-DSM. Maybe others can give their opinion on them.

Click to expand...

Yea, I thought it strange they were on the s/n was on the side, isnt it supposed to be in the barrel channel also, not on the side? Waiting on the auctioneer to get back to me about the S/N under the bolt.

Both look nice. the BSW dsm34 is far more scarce than the KKW. last three digits of the serial # will be on the bottom side of the bolt flat.

KKW may be early enough not to have a numbered bolt. I have a serial thread over on gunboards but cant view it.

I too, like them both.... Here's a link to some KKW serial info that may help....

http://www.k98kforum.com/showthread...ollection-amp-Gustloff-KKWs&highlight=simpson

The KKW would have the 3 digits on the top flat if numbered... (see pic)

Valuation.... well, perhaps 1K each, but the devil is in the details.... Value could be more, if there was complete info...


I wonder about those sn in the wood... it's not original to the factory, so who/when were they added? Close-up may help determine whether the font is period German or more modern.

Serials on these stocks would be in the channel (an in pencil)...

Good eye bob...I didn't bother looking at that last photo cause there wasn't normally anything to see in that area. Very interesting and I would have to say "very very very Odd"
to see the serial # in that location..

Font looks typical old type European not your typical harbor freight type stamps. That being said there will always be a ? as to when why and who added this... Not something you typically want associated with a rifle you own or want to own. But, this condition is so high and rifle so scarce maybe settling if the price is right.. Most people wouldn't know in a life time there shouldn't be a serial # placed on the side of the stock like that. If the bolt matches and no added serial that rifle could well exceed 1k if the right folks were bidding.


The KKw seems well below the serial cut so should not have a numbered bolt.

How rare is the BSW? Information is scarce and with how BSW continued the serials with the 625, DSM, KKW series it makes it hard to pinpoint an exact number.


I put a few questions to the auctioneer about the rifle. Below are his answers (some auctioneers don't have a clue what they are looking at when it comes to guns.)

Regarding the BSW bolt: They responded, "There is a serial number and eagle on the barrel. There is not a serial number on the bolt stem but a "B crown U."---I think they might be getting confused with the Gustloff about the eagle being present.

The auctioneer had the person that will be handling the FFL transfer look at the rifles this morning when he came in. He had more knowledge and added that in-fact the BSW did have a serial on the bolt and that the last three digits did match the last 3 digits on the receiver. He stated that both bores (BSW and KKW) are in good condition.

Mauser99 you were right about the bolt s/n not being present. Regarding the KKW they stated, "there is no eagle or serial number on the KKW bolt, but does have eagles on the receiver."

I was concerned with the KKW, from the pictures, the "G" on the top reciever asked about it and they responded that it appears "faint." Was the top of the reciever stamped in multiple passes with multiple dies, or was it a single die?

Can't find any reference to eagles being on the barrel along with the BUG.

The S/N on the stock doesn't bother me as much as, I suppose, it would an advanced collector--these would be my first 22 trainers (if I got both). I just have a thing for BSW ever since I passed up an all matching 1938 k98 last June and I've regretted it ever since. Recently, I had another chance to get a Simpson Werke Suhl DSM (with the S and triangle trademark) earlier in the year, but totally forgot about it, it went for $325.

Sounds like I should go for the BSW more than the Gustloff, but you never know what they will go for... Like you all said it depends on the crowd--I could get both for $325 you never know.

Highly unlikely you will get them for $325.00. If you do you got a screaming deal. I would value them around $1,000 each with the BSW DSM being more desirable.

KKW22cal said:

Highly unlikely you will get them for $325.00. If you do you got a screaming deal. I would value them around $1,000 each with the BSW DSM being more desirable.

Click to expand...

lol, I know I was joking, no way $325 would happen.

BSW went for $675 (I dropped out at $650). Wasn't going to pay anymore for something I couldn't see in person and had a serial number on the side of the stock. I didn't bid on the Gustloff. It was hotter than the BSW and went well over $1000--by how much I don't know. Not worth it with the "G" logo wasn't stamped correctly. Like Bob said, it's all about who is in the crowd. I'll keep looking for a the "right" trainer and when I get it I'll definitely post it here for you all to see.

$ 675 Sold
$ 101.25 15% Buyers Premium
$ 20 Auction House fee to transfer to their FFL
$ 25 for Auction House's FFL to send to my FFL
$ 60 to Ship
$ 25 for me to pickup at my FFL
$ 20 for Gas I live an hour away from an/my FFL
________
$926.25 (Not worth it)

Like I said in a previous post, I'm just starting out collecting and its guys like you--and the community as a whole--that help people like me who are just starting collecting and making sure we get off on the right foot by sharing your valuable knowledge. Thanks for all the help!