Third Party Press

Danzig 1912/15 Gew98

Warrior1354

ax - hole
Picked this rifle up about two weeks ago. Was filthy with lots of grease, dirt, and grime under the stock. Has a clipped firing pin too. From my research these are a neat variation and thought this rifle would be a good place holder. It has some isscues some mismatched parts and the stock had some type of tung oil applied too it years ago. Shame really it is the matching stock too and a rare variation. But it is depot mark for Koblenz so that may explain the mismatched parts? I did find some interesting parts too. Never have I see a barrel band marked on the inside nor a buttplate so I took some pictures of those areas. What I find really neat is how close this rifle is too the only other example posted in the Imperial picture section. They are in the same letter block and are really close too each other. So regardless of the isscues I find this rifle a keeper and a great place holder.

My rifle: 2625b
The other rifle: 2848b plus link http://www.k98kforum.com/showthread.php?17507-Battle-damaged-1912-15-Danzig-Gew-98

Maker: Danzig 1912/15

Receiver SN: 2625b
Barrel SN: 2625b B.O 196 Bohler
Front sight SN: 25
Rear sight SN: 25
Sight Slider SN: 25
Ejector box SN: 25
Trigger Sear SN: 25
Front barrel band SN: 25
Rear barrel band SN: 87
Trigger guard SN: 2625
Trigger guard screws SN: 80,68
Floor Plate SN: 10
Follower SN: 10
Stock SN: 2625
Handguard SN: unmarked
Buttplate SN: 2625 #5 Koblenz
Bayonet lug SN: 25
Cleaning Rod SN: 85
Bolt body SN: 2625b
Extractor SN: 25
Safety SN: 22
Cocking piece SN: 25
Bolt sleeve SN: 25
Firing pin SN: 25
 

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Bolt and trigger guard:
 

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Stock, barrel bands, and buttplate
 

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Interesting variation! First I have seen of this, I’ll have to read the thread in the link for sure. I have a few buttplates and I think one or two had a similar marking inside, I’ll have to look. I am wondering if the FP and follower were armorer parts prior to their numbering. I have a bunch of armorer floorplates and some have the same S on the bottom, but that may simply be coincidental to the maker and have no relation. Cool rifle for sure, thanks for all the detail pictures!
 
I like it, good pickup with that unique date. Congrats & thanks for sharing the pics.

Your very welcome Mike. Too tell you the truth I almost passed on this rifle due too the stock issues. But being this was a very uncommon variant I thought finding another would be next too impossible. Plus I think this rifle's serial number range and the letter block is important for the research study on these. So its a great place holder IMO.
 
Interesting variation! First I have seen of this, I’ll have to read the thread in the link for sure. I have a few buttplates and I think one or two had a similar marking inside, I’ll have to look. I am wondering if the FP and follower were armorer parts prior to their numbering. I have a bunch of armorer floorplates and some have the same S on the bottom, but that may simply be coincidental to the maker and have no relation. Cool rifle for sure, thanks for all the detail pictures!

Thanks Clay. As for parts I think the marking inside the front barrel band is neat never seen that before. It only caught my eye when I was cleaning the rifle yesterday.
 
As I said earlier, this is no place holder, it's extremely unlikely for you to upgrade... 1915's are damn difficult to find at all (anywhere near original-matching). the parts are probably period replaced and inconsequential anyway. I think it is a wonderful rifle, the only real distractions are minor and hardly rise to level of a nuisance.

Can you make out the wrist and lower acceptance stamps on the stock, is their enough clarity? Under the cypher would be good too if you can make it out, on Imperial wrist and lower are more important, but 1915 trends are scanty, a lot of rifles recorded, but stocks and bolts are elusive this early. Most didn't last through the war it seems, and if it stayed in German hands the Reichsheer typically rework/replaced the stock and bolt. I doubt 5% of recorded rifles have original stocks and bolts... or if so aren't well documented (pictures).

BTW, not sure what I wrote in the other thread, but there is no evidence Danzig made any G98's 1909-1913 (scanty numbers in 1908 & 1914), it is a mystery why they made G98 receivers in 1912, but it is almost assured that they made no rifles in 1912, only carbines (1908-1914), but so far no other years in this gap for spare G98 receivers.
 
I will try to get you some better pictures of the stock inspection stamps Paul but they're pretty worn. Plus it didn't help in some of those areas where the tug oil was applied it covered them up. I wish the original owner would have known better but I don't think this was done a couple years ago. This was probably done many years ago. I was very fortunate he didn't mess with the bluing or the metal finish it's actually quite nice to be honest.

If I missed anything else please let me know. I tried to include everything with this rare variation. I hope it helped with some of the research.
 
I can probably identify indistinct characters from what I have recorded, generally wartime makers follow general patterns within ranges, this is less true with the big arsenals though... The Prussian arsenals were producing considerable numbers of rifles and this was probably only possible with lessening standards and cutting corners, - Erfurt a perfect example. Those numbers, which weren't beaten until 1943 came at a cost (and even then under far more modern methods and machines, - Erfurt did their own components and supplied other at the same time.... not to mention 1917 was a tough year for civilians in Germany, hardly the same could be said of 1943 food and commodities wise).

I will try to get you some better pictures of the stock inspection stamps Paul but they're pretty worn. Plus it didn't help in some of those areas where the tug oil was applied it covered them up. I wish the original owner would have known better but I don't think this was done a couple years ago. This was probably done many years ago. I was very fortunate he didn't mess with the bluing or the metal finish it's actually quite nice to be honest.

If I missed anything else please let me know. I tried to include everything with this rare variation. I hope it helped with some of the research.
 
Still leaves the question of why these receivers were even made for rifle production. I have come too a couple conclusions and their just theories. Either these were a small run of subcontracted left over receivers supplied too Danzig. Or could these have been left over receivers for Kar98a production and they were never marked for the carbines?

I have seen a few 1912 Danzig Kar98a carbines in the same letter block. Again its just a theory.

But at least we have two examples too compare too now and their really close too each other! Paul I'll try too get you a few more pictures of the stock sometime this weekend. Have a show too do this weekend with a friend.

If there is anything else I need too take a picture of please let me know.
 
Well, that's a damned cool rifle, I really love the oddballs!

Speaking personally, I'd strip that tung oil off, I bet the stamps will be much crisper and readable without the tung oil filler...

I think it was an outstanding pick up, and really cool...good job!
 
Well, that's a damned cool rifle, I really love the oddballs!

Speaking personally, I'd strip that tung oil off, I bet the stamps will be much crisper and readable without the tung oil filler...

I think it was an outstanding pick up, and really cool...good job!

I thought about that but I'm afraid of touching the stock on such a rare variation. Plus my stock skills are not the greatest!
 
smashing piece. Maybe there's a way to remove tung oil without removing original finish underneath or at least just to remove sharpness of top tung layer
 
1912 was Danzig's strongest year for the 98a, they made it to the d-block, the only time they are known to have made it this far, or beyond, was in 1918. Though Danzig was a rather stable maker of the 98a pre-war, production totals 1909-1913 generally comparable, generally around 30k rifles per year, 1914 they cut back on 98a and restarted G98 production, but they made both in some number.

What can be gleaned from production numbers is Danzig started in 1908 modestly, probably not intentionally, possibly starting late, but partially due to her remote location and relative primitive work force (skilled labor was always their largest problem) it took sometime to begin, 1909 through 1912 maintained a strong stable rate of production (highest producer of the 4 arsenals), then in 1913 started to drop off, this could have been due to a combination of things, first the fact Spandau and Amberg had already stopped suggests that the numbers produced were approaching the desired inventory the military needed, so Erfurt and Danzig were left to toil out the remaining required... but typical of government run operations at a slower pace to keep busy (arsenals were obsolete by WWI, everyone knew it too, private concerns could produce faster, better quality and cheaper... for rifles all we need to observe is DWM/Mauser vs. the arsenals).

Lowest years for Danzig (98a prod.) is 1908, followed by 1914, followed by 1913, so in 1912 Danzig reached its peak, then started to taper off, re-starting G98 production in 1914, possibly these receivers were made in late 1912 as a plan to re-start G98 production, after all Europe late in 1912 was looking ever closer to a major war, the Balkans and Turkey were at war, Italy was poking the sick man of Europe, German naval ambitions (not to mention fear of German economic and industrial prowess) were straining England's patience, - in hindsight it is easy to see war was on the horizon, the players were setting the stage for a major confrontation. It would change the modern world in unimaginable ways, resulting in the death of the conservatism... if the French revolution and napoleon shattered the old order (the power of the first two estates, the clerical class and nobility, and give birth to the "isms", Liberalism, Socialism, Communism, etc..), WWI would dramatically change the nature of conservatism and introduce the western world to a culture of narcissism, one that began shortly after WWI and has become the dominate factor (almost an ideology) in our society today.


Still leaves the question of why these receivers were even made for rifle production. I have come too a couple conclusions and their just theories. Either these were a small run of subcontracted left over receivers supplied too Danzig. Or could these have been left over receivers for Kar98a production and they were never marked for the carbines?

I have seen a few 1912 Danzig Kar98a carbines in the same letter block. Again its just a theory.

But at least we have two examples too compare too now and their really close too each other! Paul I'll try too get you a few more pictures of the stock sometime this weekend. Have a show too do this weekend with a friend.

If there is anything else I need too take a picture of please let me know.
 
I saw this for sale an hemmed and hawed about it. Glad to see you got it! It is a hell of a rifle, your pictures are great, they really do the rifle justice! Really great pick up.
 
Well my buddy was able to bring this stock back yesterday to a much better presentation piece. Love how those stock proofs came back. He got rid of that nasty tung oil bubba put on it!
 

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Well my buddy was able to bring this stock back yesterday to a much better presentation piece. Love how those stock proofs came back. He got rid of that tasty tung oil bubba put on it!

It’s like night and day looking at that stock. Looking at the first SN photo I thought it had some dents. You would have never know it was mis-struck, until seeing it now. Whoever did the work is a real artist!
 

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