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Thread: Dual Code bcd / bnz 4 from the attic

  1. #21
    RKI- Reasonably Knowledgable Individual heavy_mech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Absolut View Post
    ..so maybe this one will make it to the Picture Reference too.
    Yeah me too. I certainly think it's worthy. The great photos only help.
    "Wen Tausend einen Mann erschlagen, das ist nicht Ruhm, das ist nicht Ehre, denn beinsen wird's in späteren tagen gesiegt hat doch das Deutsch Heer. Podest nicht die Paten der Soldaten doner die da Sterben sollen, soll man geben was sie wollen, sahs sie Herzen, sahs sie Küssen, den sie wissen nicht wann sie sterben müssen"

  2. #22
    Moderator² Loewe's Avatar
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    Neat barrel, the contrast is interesting. Regarding the crossbolt, I do not concede that it hasn't been touched post-1945, possible of course, but so too is nationalism rising in Western Europe again, - neither are very likely in my opinion.

    Finding a rifle in an attic doesn't date when it occurred, and the British (who occupied Styria in 1945 - worse the Red Army "liberated" much of Styria, including Graz, so hiding a rifle in 1945 would have been dangerous for the first month or two) were just as meticulous as the US searching for small arms to confiscate. An attic sounds like a very poor hiding place, - I can say with certainty that when the fascists come to confiscate my firearms, none will be in an attic...

    Anyway, the crossbolt orientation doesn't really matter, mostly I mentioned it to prompt a disassembly!

    Quote Originally Posted by Absolut View Post
    Paul, thank you. I hope I'll find time to get the stock off today and check for additional markings on the barrel. Re the crossbolt, not sure if I should change it. It was not touched since 1945, why should I now try to make it more correct?

  3. #23
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    The contrast of below and outside the wood is astonishing. Basically it looks like the blueing covers the grooves in the barrel and it has a better surface below the wood line. I've never seen blueing would making such a better surface quality before.

    Paul, any ideas on why this barrel has a "different" step at the very rear? I mean it is not cylindrical with sharp edges as I know from others, but rather conical with a rounded edge.

    Re the storage, I've seen and bought quite a few guns coming from the attic. Some where even hidden in clothing between roofing tiles. It does not mean it was not hidden in there, it just means it was stored there.

  4. #24
    Moderator² Loewe's Avatar
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    From recollection, I have not seen this before (barrel contrast), though I doubt it is one of a kind.

    I suspect the barrel shoulder and any other quality lapses was due to being manufactured in Gusen, though before SDP moved everything to Gusen (they had been involved in mfg of SS variations and were well acquainted with making garbage.. look at Gusen's work before the bombings and dispersal, only nazi could think moving all production to such a place was a good idea.. sounds like the Green New Deal, - great idea, one only a fanatic could endorse...), you can see a general decline in production quality, this was a growing trend made worse by SDP relying upon Radom, where conditions were hardly batter than Gusen (1/3 the workforce were Jews and savagely treated, not that Poles were treated well, - just the presence of SS meant little could be expected in the way of quality, Brno suffered this problem as well though less so). Anyway, I have seen or recorded numerous cases of shoddy work, sometimes crudely done, on barrels for SDP that never appeared at other firms. Though this is probably because QC probably still existed at Mauser (where they caught bad batches of barrels) and other "private" operated firms (private property never really existed 1935-1945, only a thin veneer or a mocking pretense, much like our country and its "mocking reverence" for a Constitution our government ignores routinely -unless you are rich and have a good lawyer)

    May-June 1945 the Red Army caught a German (Austrians included... they raped and pillaged Austria nearly as savagely as Germany) with small arms, you could kiss your ass good by, I have read reports that described these operations, they would go to farms and small towns and search for any contraband, it makes Yankee Carpetbaggers in 1865-1870 sound like missionaries. Rape was common and this was after the war, this only ended when the USSR faced the prospect of an independent Austria and felt Austrian public opinion was important to a future relationship. Then Red Officer's took measures to control their men (pistol discipline), when much of Styria went to the English, like in June 45, perhaps a hidden rifle in an attic was less dangerous, - the Americans and British were eager to accept Austrian claims of victimization at face value, and not paint them with quite the same brush as the rest of Germany (half the crooks/nazis that ran SDP during the war remained after, - only a couple got what they deserved, Meindl especially), but most Officers were not fools and military occupation was military occupation and with a lot of Austrian socialists and communist having influence after the war (postwar reports make a great deal regarding these thugs), they made efforts to secure loose arms.

    I am not sure when small arms were allowed to Austrians, but it wasn't very early, probably not under military occupation. Not sure when that ended of began to lax, but I have read reports as late as 1947 and to possess arms was hiding arms as they were generally illegal to the general public. I believe the occupation, to one degree or another lingered into the 1950's, the USSR didn't want to leave as i recall... however, I am not saying this rifle isn't original, I am saying hidden in an attic, especially in Styria or eastern Austria would have been very dangerous. I do not believe a rifle hidden in an attic with Red Army control would have survived, - and probably not the property owner either. Perhaps buried and recovered early, then the attic, or maybe some other creative hiding spot? In Germany I have read of discoveries of Imperial rifles in walls and in staircases, public buildings, these arms remained hidden through 1919-1945 and throughout the postwar period. It did occur, but I doubt an attic unless it was a wall of an attic or something more involved.

    Believe what you want and so shall I. Neat rifle either way!

    Quote Originally Posted by Absolut View Post
    The contrast of below and outside the wood is astonishing. Basically it looks like the blueing covers the grooves in the barrel and it has a better surface below the wood line. I've never seen blueing would making such a better surface quality before.

    Paul, any ideas on why this barrel has a "different" step at the very rear? I mean it is not cylindrical with sharp edges as I know from others, but rather conical with a rounded edge.

    Re the storage, I've seen and bought quite a few guns coming from the attic. Some where even hidden in clothing between roofing tiles. It does not mean it was not hidden in there, it just means it was stored there.

  5. #25
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    Impressive rifle.

    IMO, the cross bolt has been removed and put in backwards. If closely examined in the excellent images, one can see where the pin holes in the nut have been upset ever so slightly. This points towards a non-standard tool being used.

    Having owned, collected, and studied hundreds of Mausers of many origins, there is only one proper orientation for the recoil cross bolt.

    Given that the stock, its inletting, and all that being inherent to the basic accuracy of the rifle (and costly), there was only one way it could be assembled and receive a final "good enough" acceptance. A reversed cross bolt would never pass IMO, no matter what era--Imperial, Weimar, 3R, German commercial, "late war expediency" or any country that followed the base manufacture and assembly of the Mauser system.

    Regardless, a fine study of a dual code, and an excellent story and presentation.

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