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Thread: 1940 Borsigwalde Navy k98k Help Needed

  1. #11
    Super Over the Top Moderator -1/2 bruce98k's Avatar
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    Default Navy marked rifles

    I would bet that at least 50% of the Kriegsmarine issued rifles have both the E/M stock acceptance and the property numbers and or letter stamped on the disk.
    Nearly all of the Navy issued K98ks will have the E/M stock acceptance with the exception of the Army diverts, and the Chinese contract run from Mauser.

    Remember the E/M was a factory acceptance stamp indicating final Kriegsmarine acceptance. The property marks were not applied at the factory, but likely struck at the Naval depot or
    main routing facility where the weapons were received from each factory.

    I don't know about the Army diverts, but they were likely transferred from inventory held at depots and not shipped from the manufacturer.
    ---- Turbo Myš ----

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by mowzerluvr View Post
    Mailman just dropped off my "second" Ostsee marked bSw stock. Army accepted with KM disc.

    Attachment 199024Attachment 199025
    I KNEW you won it!

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

  3. #13
    Hey Buddy, is that an E/4 in your pocket?
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    Quote Originally Posted by BSchiebs View Post
    I KNEW you won it!

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
    But of course...………….

    bobo.jpg

  4. #14
    aka 8x57IS Stephan98k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mowzerluvr View Post
    If it has the M designation, chances are it will not be marked on the discs as it was already designated as a Navy rifle. When you see ostsee or nordsee designation on the discs it generally means it has an Army "H" on the butt, THEN diverted to the Navy with a disc designation. Not with both.
    Hello,

    Bruce has already explained it very well, the E/M stock acceptance stamp was a factory acceptance stamp indicating final Kriegsmarine acceptance, it has nothing to do with the Naval fleet designation (Ostsee and Nordsee) and property number. The Army diverts with E/H stock acceptance stamp AND the rifles with E/M Kriegsmarine stock acceptance stamp got the Naval fleet designation and property number on the discs.

    We know Kriegsmarine rifles with fleet designation Ostsee (Baltic Sea) and Nordsee (North Sea), around September 1939 the first "Undesignated" Kriegsmarine rifles occur. These "Undesignated" Kriegsmarine rifles only have the E/M Kriegsmarine stock acceptance stamp, no fleet designation with property number.
    In August 1939 the Navy-Group-Command West was set up in Sengwarden near Wilhelmshaven. The Navy-Group-Command West was operational command post for the North Sea and Atlantic, it led in the Norway campaign. Around one month after the set up of the Navy-Group-Command West the first "Undesignated" K98ks occur, I think there is a connection.

    Keep in mind some things are different at the other manufacturer/assembler, here's a short report about Mauser Berlin-Borsigwalde:
    - The Mauser Berlin Kriegsmarine rifles in 1937 and 1938 are Army diverts, with E/H stock acceptance stamp and fleet designation with property number.
    - In 1939 and 1940 the Mauser Berlin Kriegsmarine rifles have E/M stock acceptance stamp and fleet designation with property number, in addition there are the "Undesignated" Kriegsmarine rifles which I mentioned before.
    - The Mauser Berlin Kriegsmarine rifles in 1941 have the E/M stock acceptance stamp, they are either "Undesignated" or marked with the Nordsee Fleet designation "N" at the discs.
    Around August 1940 the Ostsee Fleet designation and property number was eliminated. The Nordsee property number was also eliminated around August 1940, the Nordsee Fleet designation "N" was eliminated around December 1941.

    The Kriegsmarine rifles are a complex topic and if I have more time in the near future, I will go into more details. I still have a request, please share the data from your Kriegsmarine rifles and also individual stocks are important.

    @ mowzerluvr
    Your new Kriegsmarine stock with Ostsee property number "O.21826" belongs to a BSW 1939, what is the serial number?

    Regards,
    Stephan

  5. #15
    Hey Buddy, is that an E/4 in your pocket?
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    I have two of them. One is sn. 7269 no suffix with O.17425 and 6751 no suffix with O.21826. Both with E/H acceptance.

    bswi.jpgDSC05017.jpg

  6. #16
    aka 8x57IS Stephan98k's Avatar
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    Thank you very much, the second one I know already.

    Regards,
    Stephan

  7. #17
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    Thanks to all for the great info concerning Mauser Berlin KM rifle markings. I feel much more confident in possibly making an informed purchase.
    I wish to express a special thank you to Stephan and Bruce.

    Best Regards, Bob

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by mowzerluvr View Post
    I have two of them. One is sn. 7269 no suffix with O.17425 and 6751 no suffix with O.21826. Both with E/H acceptance.

    bswi.jpgDSC05017.jpg
    Dave glad to see you get another fine stock from across the big pond! Could you imagine if it was turned into firewood!
    "Don't use your musket if you can kill 'em with your hatchet"

    Major Robert Rogers 1757 Founder of the U.S Army Rangers

  9. #19
    Hey Buddy, is that an E/4 in your pocket?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warrior1354 View Post
    Dave glad to see you get another fine stock from across the big pond! Could you imagine if it was turned into firewood!
    Actually, I have 3 stocks in the next shipment that had the wrist area trimmed to make hunting stocks out of. Viking Santa found them while visiting an old gunsmith. Not much left for K98 parts in Norway now so he broadened his search. In with the 3 damaged stocks he discovered an untouched bSw stock that had fortune shine down on it. No Navy property marks but an intact, matching bSw stock none the less. And yes, I bought it. Here are the damaged and the miracle e/4. Distant pic of the e/4 but it's real.

    cut98.jpgcut98c.jpgbsws1.jpgbsws.jpg

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