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S84/98 frog with mystery markings

Rittmeister

Senior Member
Looks like a mid or late war work, but I have never seen this type of markings on german leatherware before. Are some of you familiar with this marking on German frogs? Appreciate if anyone can help me.

Regards Arvid
 

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I am not expert on the frogs,but the rivets looks strange,should be smelled on leather, could be a postwar production too. b.r.Andy
 
Thanks for reply Andy! My gut feeling says this is period, but the belly can be wrong. If it is postwar it must have been produced very early. No smell of leather, or glowing tread in UV light. Both leather and sewings are typical German. It came with this WKC bayonet, and was found in the belongings of a Norwegian officer,

The bayonet have postwar Norwegian blueing, but they never produced leather frogs for S84/98 bayonets in Norway. Not in my knowledge at least. If they did, I want one.
 

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Yes it could be made postwar by Norwegia, or minimum the rivets was replaced there? i dont known the marking, but by long year using of german staff they needed some new frogs probably? even not in US belt system manner? b.r.Andy
Leather looks old, the stiching little strange, anyway between 1943 and 1953 is now not a difference to find, too late
 
If it is made in Norway right after the war it is awsome to add in my Collection, but my gut feeling still says German made. They used steel rivets on a lot of leather gear from 1943, also on bayonet frogs. No matter when and by whom it is made, I like it so well that I will keep it in the collection. Variants are exciting and one day this probably will also be placed in the right stall. Thanks again Andy for responding to the tread.
 
Maybe Slash or other experts PWCO on german frogs could help here, the piece is not extra used, and the type of rivets are typical for postwar frogs, same as opened rivets were used by late M42 frogs. By late war piece i would expect a RBNr code by this unused sample.German frogs were overhauled by many countries. When long year together it could be a norwegian using.Bayonet is still matching, so only reblued .b.r.Andy
 
Personally and from what I can see in the pics I have no problem with the frog as German produced and original. Large flat faced and hollow back rivets are seen occasionally 1943 and after; sometimes with RBNr but not always so marked. The WERSA firm in Munchen as one example used these type of rivets late in the war. I have no information regarding the circular marking.
 
Thanks for reply Slash. Yes, the Germans used rivets on a lot of leather gear in the last stages of WW2. I have both the M42 frogs, and the Wersas in my Collection. The rivets are not quite the same on these, but quite Close. The rivets that are most similar to the frog showed above, are on a holster for a signal gun I have. Here are some pictures:
 

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It looks very typical German K98k frog production...except for the rivets which are atypical. However, those flat head solid rivets show up on some late war RBN variant K98k pouches.
 
Hello Ritt
The frog is good as rivets.
The photos illustrate it ..
All that can not be explained is not Norwegian ! :facepalm:

Best regards Aws
 
Thanks for reply on thread guys. Well, had been very nice to find a leather frog of this quality made in Norway postwar, but a German variant is also good.. Have really got "rivets on the brain" during the day, and looking for the same type used on the frog. Not a full match yet, but are closing in. It looks like the German used many types of rivets on their gear. Best regards Arvid
 

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Thanks for reply on thread guys. Well, had been very nice to find a leather frog of this quality made in Norway postwar, but a German variant is also good.. Have really got "rivets on the brain" during the day, and looking for the same type used on the frog. Not a full match yet, but are closing in. It looks like the German used many types of rivets on their gear. Best regards Arvid

Arvid,
That's close enough I think ;) I probably have ammo pouches with the same rivets as on your frog. Here are a couple from my "looking for matches" post:
Regards, HB

Compare your frog rivets to these on original WW2 K98k pouches, RBN stamped:
 

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Great pics. Middle pouch in photo three has the same small rivets as used on many Model 1942 narrow bayonet frogs. HB .... is the frog shown in photo two, maker marked to the reverse?
 
Hollow back rivets on a 1939 frog by Götze & Söhne. Marking E. O. Götze > Gersdorf > 1939. Not only encountered on later production .....
 

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