arr 4 cleaning kit comparision

dot said:

Wolfgang,
Can you add more info about the Waffenamts that appears on your kits ?

I have in my collection only a few:

arr4, blue, one line, with WaA57
arr4, blue, one line, with WaA392
rco44, tan, one line, no WaA.

Antoni

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Heereswaffenamt information for Braunschweigische Blechwarenfabrik GmbH, produced Reínígungsgerät 34 (1941-1945). The information below augments the response previously provided by Wolfgang:

- arr41 - WaA57 - WaA750

- arr42 - None - WaA57 - WaA392 - WaA750

- arr43 - None - WaA20, WaA57 - WaA392

- arr4 - None - WaA20, WaA57 - WaA392

- rco4 - None

- rco44 - None

- rco45 - None

My forthcoming book explains this information in far greater detail by the use of tables and narrative which further breaks the WaA data down by style of stamping and location as well as exterior paint color. Again, this information is believed to be accurate although other unreported examples may also exist.

Slash said:

Heereswaffenamt information for Braunschweigische Blechwarenfabrik GmbH, produced Reínígungsgerät 34 (1941-1945). The information below augments the response previously provided by Wolfgang:

- arr41 - WaA57 - WaA750

- arr42 - None - WaA57 - WaA392 - WaA750

- arr43 - None - WaA20, WaA57 - WaA392

- arr4 - None - WaA20, WaA57 - WaA392

- rco4 - None

- rco44 - None

- rco45 - None

My forthcoming book explains this information in far greater detail by the use of tables and narrative which further breaks the WaA data down by style of stamping and location as well as exterior paint color. Again, this information is believed to be accurate although other unreported examples may also exist.

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Hi,
A reference book about the Reinigungsgerät 34 would be great !

About the "arr" kits, it could add:
arr42 - WaA20 and WaA068

Antoni

Slash said:

Wolfgang et al,


- rco4 (large thick font/one line)


!

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"rco4" never seen or hear about. What color?
Another variation to look for.

... these are combination as I think they left factory ... had to buy the threefold and sort out

Slash said:

Heereswaffenamt information for Braunschweigische Blechwarenfabrik GmbH, produced Reínígungsgerät 34 (1941-1945). The information below augments the response previously provided by Wolfgang:

- arr41 - WaA57 - WaA750

- arr42 - None - WaA57 - WaA392 - WaA750

- arr43 - None - WaA20, WaA57 - WaA392

- arr4 - None - WaA20, WaA57 - WaA392

- rco4 - None

- rco44 - None

- rco45 - None

My forthcoming book explains this information in far greater detail by the use of tables and narrative which further breaks the WaA data down by style of stamping and location as well as exterior paint color. Again, this information is believed to be accurate although other unreported examples may also exist.

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One can explain the different (or missing) WaA stamps with the repeated air raids on Brunswick and the destructions of the factory.
A possible explanation would be that parts of the production were sent to branches or other companies to carry out the final manufacture there. This would also explain the different manufacturer's stamps etc. The dual line arr4 stamp is not symmetric. The “4” is not centered under the “arr”. To me, it looks like this stamp was made from an earlier stamp, with the last digit ground off.
The Braunschweigische Blechwarenfabrik was located in the Frankfurter Strasse 2 - 5. This street was heavily damaged with the following air raids:
2/20/1944 and 4/8/1944. The damage caused by these two air raids was at the rate of 2,000,000 imperial marks in the manufacturing plants.
The following air raids in: 5/19/1944, 5/23/1944 and in the 8/5/1944 caused other considerable destructions in the Frankfurter Strasse. On a photo from the autumn 1944 the almost completely destroyed manufacturing plants can be seen.
Nevertheless, another 467 workers are announced at that time for the Brunswick metal goods factory. Of it were 156 slave workers (mostly female Polish), 83 other foreigners and 4 PoWs (probably Belgian).
But where did they work? Probably in (so far) unknown branches of the factory, or in impromptu manufacturing facilities.

Amberg said:

"rco4" never seen or hear about. What color? Another variation to look for.

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The only rco4 (large thick font/one line) marked cans that I have observed and recorded are painted in ordnance tan. According to my data, this is a very rare variation rg34 marking.

I have a ab44 and a CMR 44 the cmr has the must crude looking chain I have seen based on the regular chain but very crude and a bakealite oiler and unmarked tool. cmr has been repainted i will post pics tomorrow

K98k Cleaning Kit

Did some of the cleaning kits come without manufacturers codes and dates?

Albayo said:

Did some of the cleaning kits come without manufacturers codes and dates?

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Yes, there are unmarked rg34 kits. The most common unmarked kits are the early silver tinned grey metal cans with soldered internal construction and brass closure clips. Some of these kits are of thought to be the very first early 1934 production by Gustav Appel. There are other unmarked silver tinned cans that were made for export and perhaps as personal/private purchase items. These were also most probably made by the Appel firm.

Much more unusual are the later production painted rg34 cans which for unknown reasons are occasionally noted without markings. By their construction it is possible in some cases to determine the maker and approximate period of manufacture for these scarce pieces. As an example, unmarked ordnance tan painted cans have been observed which appear to have been produced by Braunschweigische Blechwarenfabrik GmbH. From the color and appearance of the paint these cans would seem to date from late 1944, possibly into 1945. An example of one of these unmarked cans is shown in Kriegsmodell (first printing). A very few unmarked cans in blue gray paint made by Gustav Apple have also been recorded. Any of the painted later production rg34 without maker codes and/or dates should be considered scarce if not rare.

My thoughts only .......

Old thread, new information. More or less.

Got this box with different dual line arr4 stamp. No WaA stamp on the box and no idea what it was made for.

Any other stuff out there with "KH", "Ky" or "arr" stamp?

Thanks
Wolfgang

talking about "arr" marked cleaning kits, I have to show this complex made FAKE "arr44" marked box.

This box started its being as a commercial/export cleaning kit, made probably in 1934/35. Back then it was tinned, had brass closure latches and was unmarked.
Now it is painted, has steel closure latches and a FAKE "arr44" + eagle stamp.

Amberg said:

Old thread, new information. More or less.

Got this box with different dual line arr4 stamp. No WaA stamp on the box and no idea what it was made for.

Any other stuff out there with "KH", "Ky" or "arr" stamp?

Thanks
Wolfgang

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Another example from my collection which seems to be of near identical construction. Paint is a different shade and this piece is eagle swastika WaA392 marked in addition to the arr > 4. The digit 4 stamping is weak. Like Wolfgang, I do not know what the box was originally intended for.

Amberg said:

talking about "arr" marked cleaning kits, I have to show this complex made FAKE "arr44" marked box.

This box started its being as a commercial/export cleaning kit, made probably in 1934/35. Back then it was tinned, had brass closure latches and was unmarked.
Now it is painted, has steel closure latches and a FAKE "arr44" + eagle stamp.

Click to expand...

Say it ain't so...!

Amberg said:

This would also explain the different manufacturer's stamps etc. The dual line arr4 stamp is not symmetric. The “4” is not centered under the “arr”. To me, it looks like this stamp was made from an earlier stamp, with the last digit ground off.

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Old thread but some additional thoughts on the arr>4 marking that might be of interest. arr>41 marking from a MG34 Öl- und Petroleumbehälter. And an arr>42 stamping found on a Patronenkasten 34. Can was originally finished in feldgrau paint over red primer with ordnance tan paint added during the period. We see this with rg34 as well.

Examining these earlier markings against the asymmetric placement of the 4 in the arr>4 stamping it does appear as if a second digit may have been removed. We know that similar stamping die modifications were realized during wartime production, ie: arr43 stamp on HKW converted to arr4 or ddl43 to ddl4 on very early 1944 S84/98 bayonets. I'm thinking Amberg might be on to something here ....