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Can anyone identify this bayonet?

Oldnrth

Oldnrth

Well-known member
One of the right is obviously a k98 bayo, however I cannot for the life of me figure out what this other is (one circled in yellow) ... any ideas??
e137e002b55717942eb51050613eeb3b.jpg



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That was my initial thought too, but the steel that runs down the middle of the handle is what threw me off, I haven’t seen any like that


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Oldnrth said:
That was my initial thought too, but the steel that runs down the middle of the handle is what threw me off, I haven’t seen any like that


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I think they call that a 1935

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Rittmeister said:
Is not bayonet marked "Terri" made in italy?
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Can't tell but I think there is an Italian model similar would be Terni if Italy no?

I know Finn Bayonets anything else is a guess but try matching to world of Bayonets, or ebayonet. Also old smithy and lastly nirvi.fi

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Thanks for the help, sure enough Italian. Any idea what it’s worth? Not mine helping a friend with a collection of random things


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capt14k said:
Can't tell but I think there is an Italian model similar would be Terni if Italy no?

I know Finn Bayonets anything else is a guess but try matching to world of Bayonets, or ebayonet. Also old smithy and lastly nirvi.fi

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The brand is Terni of course. My
mistake.
 
its probably a wrong designation when real this is a shortage of italian Veterli Vitali bayonet M1870/87, no Mannlicher at all, possible in WW1 shortened to M91 Carcano lenght or here to 250mm, as the barell ring is low and i dont see the inner diameter of barell ring i would say its for Vetterli Vitali conversion rifle. When 17,4mm MRD, when smaller so for its other rifle, i doubt that its for M95 Mannlicher. b.r.Andy
Some sources call it M1870/87/16 as the shortage was done in WW1.
 
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Andy has a good point. Muzzle ring inside diameter may be different. The M1870/87/16 should have a o/a length of 368mm and blade length of 240mm. My Italian reference book does not supply muzzle ring inside diameter. Will have to wade thru the four volumes of Kiesling, which does supply this in his descriptions...
 
Possible some of the blade were shortened only to 240mm as with remains of long blade of Veterli Vitali bayonets were made fighting knives Pugnale and some ersatz bayonets for captured rifles. b.r.Andy
 
AndyB said:
Possible some of the blade were shortened only to 240mm as with remains of long blade of Veterli Vitali bayonets were made fighting knives Pugnale and some ersatz bayonets for captured rifles. b.r.Andy
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I looked in Kiesling's books. He describes the M1870/87/16 as being for the "Mannlicher-Carcano" rifles. Inside MR diameter reported as 13.3mm. I did not find mention of this pattern for the Austrian M95 rifle. However, he does show a similar modification of the Italian Truppi Speciale M70, with a MR inside diameter as 15.6mm. The book I used (Baionette Italiane 1814-1991) shows both types as for the Mannlicher M95. So, If the MR I.D. is 15.6mm on either, it would accommodate the M95 rifle.
 
The diameter of barell ring for M95 is 15mm, 15,5mm is typical for 8mm Mauser rifles, same is here is the origin crossguard, and the barell ring doesnt look bushed out to smaller diameter, conversion of Vitalli to Carcano caliber, didnt get automatically small muzzle diameter to 13 or 13,5mm, the reason is simply the barells were destined for old buttstocks,so what made to accomodate in old rifles, so the difference in Carcano 91 and Vitali 70 is on high position of barell ring, the Vitali are low as on barell is the bayonet adapter. The Mannlicher 95 or Carcano 91 barell rings are higher positioned because of bayonet adapter is placed on front ring.
The owner should provide the details of the barell ring, high above blade? inner MRDiameter?
 
Unfortunately I don’t have any additional information, passed what we had discussed onto him and I believe he has already sold it. Thank you again for all of the help!


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I believe its visible from picture, there is mostly 17mm barell diameter, the blade width is 27mm. For this speaks the origin Vitali crossguard with serial number.
In some literature is called M1870/15. b.r.Andy
 

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