Gustloff KKW ZF41 Sniper
- Thread starter Hercules
- Start date
Hercules
Senior Member
Ken, it is smooth like yours. See picture below. Thanks.
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Absolut
Senior Member
All of the original ones known have a serial in this range, I think it starts at 269.xxx and lasts to 272.xxx somewhere (please do let me know if you have or know a Gustloff rifle with ZF41 rail that is a bit higher or lower of this range). A friend of mine got an original ZF41 mount serialized to one of these rifles in the 270.xxx serial range which I'm since then trying to buy from him, but since he only wants to trade and we couldn't find anything to trade with him it still is with him.
To my knowledge all of the .22 ZF41 mounts had the same scope manufacturer on all of them, but would need to look up which one it was.
To my knowledge all of the .22 ZF41 mounts had the same scope manufacturer on all of them, but would need to look up which one it was.
WreckTangle
Mad Dog 20/20 Connoisseur (RIP Brother 06-05-203)
Super sweet KKW ZF41. Where do you all find these things?
Virginia is the black abyss of anything good. There is never anything decent locally.
Virginia is the black abyss of anything good. There is never anything decent locally.
WreckTangle
Mad Dog 20/20 Connoisseur (RIP Brother 06-05-203)
Super sweet KKW ZF41. Where do you all find these things?
Could you post a picture of the left side of the rear band? Want to see how the stamped the part the sling goes through. A few months ago I saw a BSW KKW at an auction and it had a similar smooth rear band. I though it was from something else because it was basically sheet metal. How thick is the metal on yours?
BTW that BSW Went for ~3k and it was nothing
Virginia is the black abyss of anything good. There is never anything decent locally. Sad
Bob in OHIO
Senior Member
IMO, I suspect the smooth bSw band was not orig to the rifle... those only show on the late Gustloffs, and are Buchenwald related. I believe the OP's rifle came from a well-known dealer...
Hercules
Senior Member
Thanks for the reply. I think the band is the standard thickness. Looks same as earlier Gustloff KKW bands. Always searching for sniper stuff in various different sources.
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BGcollector
Well-known member
Absolut
Senior Member
Digging through original files I came across a document dating 24th January 1945. It treats a sniper course at the school for "gang fighting" ("Bandenbekämpfung" in German; tough to translate that to English). The course was (weapon-wise) equipped with 60 scoped rifles, 30 "DF" (what I assume means "Doppel Flinte", English "double shotgun") as well as 6 .22 rifles with ZF41 - and very interestingly they list these originate from H Za Naumburg.
They do not mention the model nor the maker of these guns, but at least it is documented that these guns originate from Naumburg.
They do not mention the model nor the maker of these guns, but at least it is documented that these guns originate from Naumburg.
tonino7
Senior Member
I think that an acceptable translation in english of "Bandenbekämpfung" can be " resistance fighter warfare" .
Absolut
Senior Member
Yes, "gang fighting" might be a term more modern than back then. But obviously you did understood it 
. One can however argue if the Germans really only meant resistance fighting, or generally fight of criminals/outlaws. This however is a discussion not really on the topic itself, most important is that there is a proof the ZF41 scoped .22 rifles were used at sniper courses.
. One can however argue if the Germans really only meant resistance fighting, or generally fight of criminals/outlaws. This however is a discussion not really on the topic itself, most important is that there is a proof the ZF41 scoped .22 rifles were used at sniper courses.
Bandenkämpfung was Anti-Partisan Warfare. The decision from on high was to call all resistance fighters Bandits, to not apply any type of positive spin to their activities. As this was spearheaded by the SS, I presume school mentioned was one of the SS schools? Or was it was one of the Heer schools? Can you share this information?
Absolut
Senior Member
Since stumbling over this document again, back when I had posted I missed to address this document particularily names the "Scharfschützenausbildungs-Kompanie XVII.A.K., Wehrkreisschießschule Bruck a.Leitha" as recipent of the items in question. Hence those were shipped to Austria ("Bruck an der Leitha"). I believe @BGcollector once told me (not in this forum) one of his ZF41 .22 rifles comes from Austria, so it could well be that his was one of the six rifles from this sniper course.
