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Danzig Gewehr 98m Reworked in 1939?

I agree. It really does seem like it was reworked towards the end of the 30’s my guess would be 1937, then again in 1940. Overall i really think this rifle has taught me alot. Im just wondering if i can maybe find a faint HZa marking, or if the wing that i found on the grip was the HZa depot marking, its hard to tell. I really would like to learn more about the history of these rifles, as they have seen so much history. I think that the wing that i found “was” the depot marking, but it was poorly stricken, faded and eventually lost almost entirely
 
I can't make out or see any part of the marking within the circle, but "generally" the acceptance would be more centered along the area where the trigger guard lines up, it can be off to one side or another or lower on the rounded area, or almost anywhere along the lower edge of the buttstock, also very common on the sides of the buttstock, but the Germans weren't French or Italians, they were pretty rigid and predictable within their patterns. Mostly the differences are a product of time, place and the individual (and his circumstances), but the guidelines seem to be generally adhered too.

That it is very difficult to find means it probably has worn away or weakly struck and would add little to the value.. the rifle looks in great condition too, which makes it all the more unusual (often these rifles are beat up or mismatchers and its more understandable the markings are gone or indecipherable...) Had it been clearly identifiable, especially if it identified both depots, the value would have been higher, but there is little doubt this is authentic, - these are not valuable enough to entice the best humpers to "create" or "enhance" them. They prefer the big game, the German pistols and variations of the 98k and perhaps some work the Imperial angles (where it is easier and sometime profitable - its is far easier to "enhance" a G98 than a 98k or Republican era rework.. it is common practice for collectors to parts swap to "match" up small mismatched parts, the study of acceptance patterns among Imperial era arms is far more work than numeric waffenamts...)
 
I took her outside (better light) would've done it earlier but it was raining for 3 days in SC. I didn't find an LK5 stamp, or a depot stamp unfortunately. infact i didnt even find an indentation where it should be. No idea why, but maybe the whole thing was just assembled in one place, with parts that were leftover? would make sense as to why some parts are of earlier manufacture, but still i would expect a depot stamp but I don't know. maybe one day someone will find a rifle similar to mine, and comparisons can be made
 
Speaking of the 1937, the barrel band does have an eagle, and a suww 1937 on it i dont know if this helps in identifying anything
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It is one of the upgrade rear bands, only Simson and HZa Spandau made them. It would have been marked like this when made, not necessarily the installation. It was designed to give more surface area to this load bearing surface. As anyone who has owned a G98 will testify, the original narrow band sometimes slips loose the spring and under load can marr the stock around this point. I am sure the extra metal keeps it from, or less prone to, breaking.

I assume this band matches? If it doesn't it is unrelated, though the spring holding in place would also suggest this was the original configuration. It does lend some credibility to the "guess" that this was HZa Spandau done; while these bands were supplied to others the combination of the weird stock acceptance and this band does support this scenario. Depots, especially small fries, didn't usually add the E/H (in the Republican era they did, you often see E/H, E/M or E/P, this is why I think a big depot might be behind this, but HZa Spandau is usually proud of their work and probably the most prone to marking the stock...), though I would still tend to hang my hat of these E/H and nazi eagles were applied at different times (though I can't see a good reason why)

Would the SuWw indicate a production/repair facility at the HZa Spandau? Not a civilian/commercial factory/business? Thank you.
 
Would the SuWw indicate a production/repair facility at the HZa Spandau? Not a civilian/commercial factory/business? Thank you.

Joe, I believe it represents the band manufacturer, much in the same way S/42K/G represents the components mfg (only Simson and Spandau are known to have made these wider bands which were a clear improvement to the narrow bands) . The parts show up on rifles with no direct connection to HZa Spandau. I do not recall the issue or date, but I believe Mark Wieringa wrote a brief (2 page) article in Automag on the subject. I do not recall what he stated exactly, but he gave his thoughts to the subject and his observations. I am sure his thoughts influenced mine as they do on several subjects.

Somewhat related is the Spreewerke barrels (Spreewerke Berlin) made during rearmament, these have Spreewerke trademarks but HZa acceptance (Su##) I believe HZa Spandau retained much of its Spandau Arsenal roles, at least until rearmament was well underway. Unlike the barrels, which have a commercial trademark (along with HZa Spandau acceptance), the bands have ony the Su markings and bands are well within HZa Spandau's capabilities, they clearly did complex work, the 1929 conversion plan that led to the 98k, the fact it was the center of ordnance work (more so than Kassel/Cassel) during the Republican period.
 
Joe, I believe it represents the band manufacturer, much in the same way S/42K/G represents the components mfg (only Simson and Spandau are known to have made these wider bands which were a clear improvement to the narrow bands) . The parts show up on rifles with no direct connection to HZa Spandau. I do not recall the issue or date, but I believe Mark Wieringa wrote a brief (2 page) article in Automag on the subject. I do not recall what he stated exactly, but he gave his thoughts to the subject and his observations. I am sure his thoughts influenced mine as they do on several subjects.

Somewhat related is the Spreewerke barrels (Spreewerke Berlin) made during rearmament, these have Spreewerke trademarks but HZa acceptance (Su##) I believe HZa Spandau retained much of its Spandau Arsenal roles, at least until rearmament was well underway. Unlike the barrels, which have a commercial trademark (along with HZa Spandau acceptance), the bands have ony the Su markings and bands are well within HZa Spandau's capabilities, they clearly did complex work, the 1929 conversion plan that led to the 98k, the fact it was the center of ordnance work (more so than Kassel/Cassel) during the Republican period.

I didn't realize Spandau was an industrial center with commercial manufacturers besides the old Spandau/HZa Su facilities. The reason I ask, is that on another forum, a canvas strap with a small karabiner clip attached was proposed as a flare pistol lanyard. On the karabiner clip is stamped SuWw/1938 and some type of an acceptance stamp over 4. I thought it was a mark of a military Spandau Waffenwerkstatt, rather than a commercial enterprise. I will go looking for Mark's article. Only fifty indexes to examine! Thank you for your thoughts.
 
So I think I've made some headway with some research there is currently a gunbroker listing for a Gew98M similar to the one I've shown here with the two swastika eagles on the stock, one on the bottom and one on the right side. It is also a BSW stock. It is also lacking the HzA mark on the stock interestingly enough. I guess its a new pattern or style for marking maybe? The rear sight is also marked s/42 without suffix. It even has the same barrel lot number 107/39 Dö. I think its cool to find another rifle that seems similar to mine.
 
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So I think I've made some headway with some research there is currently a gunbroker listing for a Gew98M similar to the one I've shown here with the two swastika eagles on the stock, one on the bottom and one on the right side. It is also a BSW stock. It is also lacking the HzA mark on the stock interestingly enough. I guess its a new pattern or style for marking maybe? The rear sight is also markes s/42 without suffix. It even has the same barrel lot number 107/39 Dö

Please don't mention that rifle I tried buying it off Proxidbid lol! Love the stock and that it's an Amberg. I wanted it because I like the Weimer era but because I had a nice Amberg Gew98m bolt in my parts bins that would perfect with it.
 
Hahaha Yea it looks very nice, I'm just happy to find another rifle that looks like mine. it makes me feel a lot secure knowing I'm not the only one with a variation like this! I guess sense the bid ended i can post the link?: https://www.gunbroker.com/item/875518556

The question still arises, who did the rework on mine and this one?
 
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BSW made ordnance spare stocks, barrels, and some bands for the upgraded G98. Simson (BSW before 1933) also made large numbers of barrels, sight parts etc... but I do not believe Simson (and especially BSW) reworked or upgraded G98's. Like all commercial firms that made military rifles under contract, rifles went through military inspection and acceptance and bad rifles sometimes were sent back that sometimes slipped through or developed mfg related flaws but commercial firms simply didn't do refurbishment, rebuilds or conversions except under unique situations/contracts (like BLM conducted converting foriegn rifles under contract).

Conversions, upgrades and modifications of rifles in military hands was conducted by the ordnance depots, this includes 1924-1933, that Simson may have been involved with some reworking related to MG's or P08's is possible, but I have seen nothing to suggest such work with the G98 or 98a (other than supplying components).

I once thought such a possibility existed, I have/had read somewhere that Simson did some reworking of MG's, possibly P08, or that some collectors of those devices believed so, but after significant comparisons of upgraded G98's to 98b's acceptance patterns (and proofs) I did not find any compelling evidence of a connection. And by their nature, commercial firms are not the best suited for such reworkings and upgrading, they are far costlier and such work doesn't lend itself to profitable execution, each reworked rifle will demand special attention, work or fitting, hardly conductive to mass production... and this was the exact reason why Simson was excluded from the conversion of Kar.98b to Kar.98k program (the program that led ultimately to the 98k development, basically the 98k came about through experiments shortening 98b to 98k length), they were deemed too costly.
 
Have you possibly found any tracks as to who could've made these, with the two swastika eagles, it seems maybe something smaller?
 
I think Spandau did the rework on that Amberg that was posted for sale on gunbroker as well. They both have Spandau characteristics IMO. But there are other smaller depots that have yet to be discovered yet.

Were still trying to find out what this Ap5 on my rear sight means. A unknown depot that marked this rear sight maybe?
 

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Strange marking, is this a rifle posted here before? If so mfg/ser, what are the other markings and structure of the sleeve?
 
I went searching through other rifles on the forum, and posts about depot, and field armorers level repairs. Since the stock is lacking a sort of Depot marking be it an HZa or the like, could it be an armorers replacement?

Im not sure how one could prove that it is, but disproving would be easier. I'm still a bit bewildered by the Two NS eagles one on the heel, and one behind the bolt takedown. I wonder if it has something to do with a depot. I dont suspect that it could be an armorers acceptance stamp or something?
 

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