Third Party Press

Firearms of Imperial German overseas forces.

A great discovery, - all the more because you saved it!

I will try and pull the trends on bayonets ASAP...
 
Here is something you don't see everyday. I saw this on a Facebook group. I asked the owner for more details and photos. I have only every seen one 1871 Jägerbüchse from Kamerun. That was Craig Brown's rifle and it was used by the Polizeitruppe of Kamerun.
1875/ÃWG/2687f/Sch.K (This rifle is part of a private collection in Germany)
 

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Michael, I took some time off and recorded bayonet observations for KS-SB (not all KM as that would double the list.)

Many of these may be duplicates to your research or to the reports made here by others:


SG 98:

1899 Erfurt K.S.26

1899 Erfurt O.E.27. sawback
1900 Erfurt O.E.2.241

1902 Erfurt 1.O.R.3.62. (JN)
1900 Erfurt 2.O.R.3.103
1901 Erfurt 2.O.R.9.49
1900 Erfurt 4.O.R.3.189
1900 Erfurt 4.O.R.4.118
1900 Erfurt 5.O.R.3.97 (JN)
1900 Erfurt 6.O.R.5.62. (JN)

ND Simson & Co I.S.B.651 (Carter)
ND Simson & Co I.S.B.1129
ND Simson & Co I.S.B.2285
ND Simson & Co I.S.B.3220
ND Simson & Co II.S.B.1226 (Carter)
ND Simson & Co II.S.B.325
ND Simson & Co II.S.B.2539 (JN)
1902 Simson & Co. II.S.B.2876 (JN)
ND Simson & Co II.S.B.3092
ND Simson & Co II.S.B.3140
ND Simson & Co. III.S.B.3.141 (Carter)
1907 Simson & Co III.S.B.1.130 (Carter)

ND Simson & Co. II.E.S.B.1541 (Carter)
1900 Erfurt I.S.B.4102 (Carter)
1900 Erfurt III.S.B.4.33 (Carter)
ND Erfurt I.E.S.B.1593
1900 Erfurt I.E.S.B.1670 (Carter)
1901 Erfurt III.St.S.B.342
1901 Erfurt III.St.S.B.349 (Carter)
1908 Erfurt III.S.B.5.133. Sg98.05 sawback



KS 98:

19xx Erfurt SB K.S.10611 (date unknown)
1904 Erfurt SB K.S.87
1904 Erfurt SB K.S.825
1906 Erfurt SB K.S.280
1908 Erfurt SB K.S.358
1909 Erfurt SB K.S.427
1909 Erfurt SB K.S. 9882
1910 Erfurt SB K.S.1066
1910 Erfurt SB K.S.1485
1910 Erfurt SB Sch.D.O.A.322
1910 Erfurt SB Sch.K.356
1911 Erfurt SB Sch.K.12.29
1912 Erfurt SB K.S.2313

JN= Jeff Noll
ND= no date
SB= sawback when not part of unit
 
Nice (rare) rifle, I added it to the 71 study.

Here is something you don't see everyday. I saw this on a Facebook group. I asked the owner for more details and photos. I have only every seen one 1871 Jägerbüchse from Kamerun. That was Craig Brown's rifle and it was used by the Polizeitruppe of Kamerun.
1875/ÖWG/2687f/Sch.K (This rifle is part of a private collection in Germany)
 
Nice (rare) rifle, I added it to the 71 study.

I was quite happy to add it to my catalogue of documented rifles.
That's a good start on catalogue in bayonets. I'll add the bayonets to my list. So I can start adding to it myself.
 
I've kind of been waiting a while to post this. I wanted to wait until the auction was over with. I do know Storz talks about these rifles in his Rifle & Carbine 98 Firearms of the German Army from 1898 to 1918 book. It is also mentioned and feature in "The arming of the protection troops in German South West Africa with long weapons with special consideration of the protection troop rifle 98 by Kuratoriums-Kurier" Production numbers of this of SchutztruppenGewehr 98 is kinda unknown for now. This SchutztruppenGewehr 98 was manufactured in 1914 by Spandau. It bolt is bent not curved. It has the same type of bolt as in the cyclist or Radfahrer Gew 98. 1914/Spandau/10/?
Here is the link for more information.
 

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This SchutztruppenGewehr 98 was manufactured in 1914 by Spandau.
That rifle would require a very close inspection.
A 200 meter rear sight for S-ammo on a 1914 rifle?
If Spandau, or any other Gewehrfabrik had developed such a sight by 1914, why didn't the German Army introduce that sight for general use? They rather introduced the fragile and easy to loose Nahkorn.
Most questionable! IMHO
 
Hello everyone. I'm making this list separate from the main list because of provenance and information about these Machine guns. I am adding a small section to the book project about machine guns. I will say information about 1915/DWM/5008 is not set in stone. The information about this machine gun may change over time. The owner and I are still doing research.
I will add The blockade runner Marie delivered supplies to German East Africa or DOA on March 16th 1916. It included Six machine guns with telescopic sights. 3,000,000 rounds of assorted ammunition. 200 kilograms of quinine (to fight the ever-present malaria). So there could be a real chance that the machine gun was brought over by the Marie but like I already said research is on going.
Photos below are of two machine guns that have been restored and the Machine gun used by German Navy before being used by the Ottoman Empire. Hope you enjoy.

1912/DWM/1115 (This MG08 which is a German Navy MG08, on an Acland tripod. Estimated manufacture date 1912. captured by the Cape Corps in a bayonet charge in German East Africa in 1917.)

1912/Spandau/1871 (This MG08 was used by Colonial police in the DOA, with unusual 1909 commercial type tripod." captured by the Cape Corps in a bayonet charge in German East Africa in 1917.)

Note: (Both MG08 1115 and 1871 have been restored by C. Amm and now on display in a museum in Capetown.)

1912/Spandau/1741 (This MG08 was used in the GSWA.)

1915/DWM/5008 (provenance unknown, but the most unusual trenchmount suggests DOA use. This MG08 may have been in the 1916 Marie shipment, as the trench mount that it is mounted on would likely have not been available as early as 1915.)
This MG08 is part of C. Amm collection.

1910/DWM/817 (This MG08 was aboard either the SMS Goeben or SMS Breslau when they sailed into the Mediterranean Sea before the First World War. When war broke out both ships made for Istanbul where they placed themselves under Ottoman naval command.
Soon after and indeed largely due to the ships' involvement, the Ottoman Empire was dragged into the war on the side of Germany and Austria-Hungary. Britain and France launched an invasion of the Dardanelles straights (although the British contingent was largely made up of Australian and New Zealand troops and the French contingent was partially Senegalese) at Gallipoli. To assist the defending Ottoman army the German ships sent machine guns and their crews to the frontline. This machine gun was captured at the Second Battle of Krithia on 6th May 1915 by Hood Battalion of the 2nd (Royal Naval) bergade.
They then presented it to their overall commanding officer, the departing French commander, General Albert d'Amade. The gun remained in d'Amade's chateau until after his death in 1941. The new owners of the chateau handed it in to the French Gendarmerie, who in turn tried to give it to the "Musée de l'Infanterie" at Montpellier but they turned it down. Finally it was given to its present owner, a gunsmith named Gilles Sigro.)

Sources:
Kaiserscross.com by Harry Fecitt
GermanColonialUniforms.co.uk by Chris Dale © 2003-20
Special thanks to Gilles Sigro, C. Amm and J.
Kindred.
 

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Hi, I am new to this Forum, although have read many pieces with interest over the years.
With regard to 'Loewe's' list of Colonial bayonets. You may or may not have picked up on an excellent book by Ian Jackson on the kS98 bayonet. (Kurzes Seitengewehr 1898 Model, Stoneleigh Press, Auckland, 2020.) As well as covering the European issue there are comprehensive lists of examples recorded for Togo, Cameroons, East Africa as well as South West Africa. While not quite on topic, its very interesting to compare markings, deliveries etc. etc.
 
Hi, I am new to this Forum, although have read many pieces with interest over the years.
With regard to 'Loewe's' list of Colonial bayonets. You may or may not have picked up on an excellent book by Ian Jackson on the kS98 bayonet. (Kurzes Seitengewehr 1898 Model, Stoneleigh Press, Auckland, 2020.) As well as covering the European issue there are comprehensive lists of examples recorded for Togo, Cameroons, East Africa as well as South West Africa. While not quite on topic, its very interesting to compare markings, deliveries etc. etc.
I have actually been meaning to email Ian and buy his book.
 
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Hi Michael,
I doubt you will be disappointed. By far the best research into this area to date in my opinion. Much totally new information gathered from collections/museums from all over the the world. Eg. he has I think solved the enigma of the DSWA kS's seemingly random numbering system..... I have been comparing it with your database of rifles and it all makes for interesting reading.
 

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