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Thread: Unmarked 84/98

  1. #1
    Senior Member Cololab's Avatar
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    Default Unmarked 84/98

    I thought I'd photos of an unmarked bayonet I dragged home from somewhere. No maker marks or proofs anywhere except for the number 663 on the inside of the press stud. I couldn't get the grips off, so I have no idea what might be under them. The scabbard is likewise devoid of any markings or proofs. Fortunately, the frog is very nicely marked.

    The blade profile of the false edge looks like someone removed too much material and the true edge doesn't look properly ground either. The overall appearance looks later war (or maybe post war)?

    Thoughts?
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  2. #2
    Senior Member waffenmeister's Avatar
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    Very nice bayonet with a killer frog.

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    Senior Member AndyB's Avatar
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    Nice blanko piece, Behoerden S84/98, most real 1943/4 date, frog of this maker normally have a brown paint over leather or is patinated, this is a LW type. The point of blade is little under center, anyway i dont believe its postwar refurbished.I would preffer a Hoerster as possible maker, but maybe Slash or other Experts have other opinion.
    with best regards, Andy

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    Moderator Slash's Avatar
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    The bayonet was made by Hörster. The locking bolt or lug appears to be a replacement, not original to the piece. The top beveled edge at the tip is unevenly completed which is not unusual. Agree with Andrej that the blade is all period; not post war refurbished. A nice behoerden piece for sure. Unusual to see frogs in unfinished leather. Thanks for posting ....

  5. #5
    Senior Member Cololab's Avatar
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    Thanks, gentlemen, for the courtesy of your replies. Since I know just about enough about these blades to be dangerous (if I'm even at that level of knowledge), would you be so kind as to tell me what features enabled you to determine the maker of this bayonet?

    Thanks again!

  6. #6
    Senior Member waffenmeister's Avatar
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    Grinding marks on the blade are typical of Horster as well as the finish of the lower portion of the scabbard.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Cololab's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by waffenmeister View Post
    Grinding marks on the blade are typical of Horster as well as the finish of the lower portion of the scabbard.
    Thanks for sharing your observations. I think I see the manufacturing characteristics you identify when I compare this bayonet to my matching 44asw. The matching 42asw in the photos definitely reflects differences and the higher level of earlier war manufacturing.

    Thanks again to all who helped here. Left to my own abilities I would have never identified the unmarked bayonet as having been made by Horster.
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    Senior Member AndyB's Avatar
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    Yes side by side comparation is the best choice, mainly by similar dated pieces, 1943/44. There are not so many firm produced blankos so the identifying is easier.
    The frog could be depot piece, not used, long time out of sun, there are some natural leather frogs of 1942 from different maker too observed.
    with best regards, Andy

  9. #9
    Senior Member Cololab's Avatar
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    Out of curiousity, where in the overall scheme of bayonet usage do these unmarked items fall? Were they sold or otherwise provided to military units or were they used by other organizations?

    I should have added that I found a forum post that states bayonets like this one were principally issued to various governmental organizations. That said, did the SS ever get any of these unmarked bayonets?
    Last edited by Cololab; 04-19-2021 at 02:56 PM.

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    Gotta love them red grips

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