Third Party Press

Posen (?) Depot Build

chrisftk

Moderator
Staff member
Hi guys,

This one was mentioned on another thread, but thought I'd do a clean post for the photo spread.

As many of you know I love Suhl rifles (particularly Gew98s and Sauer k98k), but also enjoy depot work. I have a half dozen depot rifles and thought this would fit well, despite being priced at the higher end of what I'd want to pay. I won't name members here but a few were peer pressuring me too. [emoji12]

The rifle, at least to me, looks like typical Posen work. The receiver is a '17 Haenel Gew 98(weird flaw damage on the underside) and a combination of Imperial and Nazi era parts were used in the build. The stock is a later Mauser armorer spare.

Rather than a serial study, I thought it would be more interesting to point out what was used and if it was force matched.

Receiver: Haenel Suhl '17
Barrel: Suhl e/214 (matched)
Bolt body: Astrawerke e/1 (matched)
Bolt shroud: (suspected imperial)(matched)
Cocking piece: (imperial)(matched)
Firing pin: (imperial) (matched)
Safety: (imperial) (matched)
Extractor: e/135
Extractor collar: e/18
Ejector box: unmarked
Stock: e/655 byf armorer (matched)
Handguard: "c" (matched)
Front band: (imperial, milled parade hook) (matched)
Rear band: unmarked, (matched)
Band spring: e/37
Triggerguard: (imperial) (matched)
Floorplate: unknown, (matched)
Front screw: unmarked
Rear screw: no inspection
Lock screws: one imperial, one blank
Follower: e/1
Rear sight sleeve: s/42 e/63
Rear sight ramp: p74
Rear sight leaf: elite diamant "i"
Rear sight slider: e/655
Rear sight button: e/18
Front sight blade: unmarked
Front sight base: unmarked
Bayonet lug: e/6
Buttplate: dwc e/142 (matched)
Trigger/sear: unmarked
Recoil lug: (imperial)

My only area of concern was the rear sight, which used an ecceletic mix of parts, mostly unnumbered except the ramp, which has a mm #. Based on the overall finish and look though I think it is OK.




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Yeah I like it alot. That recoil lug surface on the bottom of the receiver is still really interesting to me. Made wrong? Damaged? Definitely some neat quirks. The ramp looks like its been on the rifle awhile. Pretty neat piece overall!

John.
 
Sure is a cool rifle! Depots definitely let a lot of numbering go on small parts, bayo lugs seem to be the most common. The rear sight wear definitely matches well, can’t recall seeing any like that but it certainly doesn’t scream replacement.
 
Something else maybe the real knowledgable guys on depot work can ponder. Look at the font on the bands, bolt parts, butt plate and bottom metal. Quite different from the font on the barrel and receiver. The 4, 5 and 7 are all different and not what I'd expect from one of the factories. The 7 actually looks slightly larger (longer?) than the other digits. No serifs on the 4s on those parts either.

Does that font seem familiar for a certain depot?
 
Another question. Any thoughts on who made the butt plate? It seems from searching that Dr. Ing. Boehme u. Co., Werksleitung Luedenscheid, Werk Minden in Westfalen did a fair bit of diverse items in steel. Machine gun links. Gas tubes for the Stg 44. Grenade launcher but in that case it seems the waff is e/642 but inspection teams moved.
 
I’ve put many hours into trying to guess what depots reworked “unattributed” rifles like this and came to the conclusion it’s impossible to know for certain. But, clues such as the fact the barrel has a serial/suffix stamp can indicate timeframe and narrow down to certain depots. However, It seems clear to me with all I have seen that depots ordered number stamps from similar places, and regional depots may share fonts, and even change over time. Firing proofs can be clues too, but the issue in the end is some rifles had multiple reworks.

Just looking at it, I suspect early Posen work because of the heavy grinding and serial/suffix on the barrel, but just as likely a Hauptnebenzeugamt of Posen. Hell, could be a bad day at Spandau.

All that said, I like it. Don’t get caught up on mismatched small parts on reworks, these guys didn’t seem to care. Remember that reworks seem to follow TL guidelines in regards to numbered parts, and by late 41 serials were dropped on some of these components on normal production as well as reworks.


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..I suspect early Posen work because of the heavy grinding and serial/suffix on the barrel

Yeah you can really see the grinding particularly on the floor plate and firing pin (looks like trace of the same serial too) and I suspose they did this where it 'mattered' at the time of the build.

All that said, I like it. Don’t get caught up on mismatched small parts on reworks, these guys didn’t seem to care.

Me too for sure. I noticed the ejector box is mismatched but again I suppose it didn't matter when this was put together. Thinking maybe they had a 'list' at the time of work that was required and if it wasn't on the list they didn't mess with it. Lot's of the odd parts seem to be ones that were commonly suppled to the ordinance spares so no heartburn over those bits either.

Thanks for the input as always! :thumbsup:
 
Thanks Guys-- appreciate all the feedback as always! Glad I went with my gut on buying this one.

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Thanks Guys-- appreciate all the feedback as always! Glad I went with my gut on buying this one.

Yeah, nice grab. Price depending I'm sure I would have had a hard time passing too. It's got a great vibe whereas a MM is just a soulless turd IMHO.
 
I think it's a wonderful rifle Chris I need to get my Posen depot rifle posted up here pretty soon to compare the two it has a bunch of interesting parts.
 
..I need to get my Posen depot rifle posted up here pretty soon

Yes please! I understand with the amount of photos you've been taking I might have to wait a bit but I'll be waiting and watching for it. Seems they're some real 'hidden gems'. Wonder how long until fraudsters figure that out and start boosting fake depot rifles? I hope not but it seems inevitable. Like Ham always says they're not faking bottle caps or pocket lint.
 
I think it's a wonderful rifle Chris I need to get my Posen depot rifle posted up here pretty soon to compare the two it has a bunch of interesting parts.
Thanks buddy-- looking forward to seeing yours. Funny, you, Marc and I all score one back to back. Hot streak for our crew! Lol.
Very nice rifle!
Thanks!
Yeah, nice grab. Price depending I'm sure I would have had a hard time passing too. It's got a great vibe whereas a MM is just a soulless turd IMHO.
I wouldn't have minded paying less(who wouldn't?), but I don't regret buying it, so that's all that matters.

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Yes please! I understand with the amount of photos you've been taking I might have to wait a bit but I'll be waiting and watching for it. Seems they're some real 'hidden gems'. Wonder how long until fraudsters figure that out and start boosting fake depot rifles? I hope not but it seems inevitable. Like Ham always says they're not faking bottle caps or pocket lint.
Yeah, far from an absolute, but my rule of thumb for depot vs humped renumbering has usually been the depot guys look like they didn't even care. The "good" humpers have some semblance of trying to look right and the bad ones look just cartoonish.

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Yes please! I understand with the amount of photos you've been taking I might have to wait a bit but I'll be waiting and watching for it. Seems they're some real 'hidden gems'. Wonder how long until fraudsters figure that out and start boosting fake depot rifles? I hope not but it seems inevitable. Like Ham always says they're not faking bottle caps or pocket lint.

It is quite the rifle the bolt group alone has well over eight different manufacturers!
 
Yeah, far from an absolute, but my rule of thumb for depot vs humped renumbering has usually been the depot guys look like they didn't even care. The "good" humpers have some semblance of trying to look right and the bad ones look just cartoonish.

And thankfully we can still usually tell... even on the 'good' ones.
 

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