Third Party Press

New to the mauser world and looking for info

Jbenkert90

Member
I recently got my first k98. It doesn’t have a manufacturer stamp but has several WaA359 markings. Many parts such as barrel, receiver, safety select, floor plate, bolt, and bolt release have matching serial numbers. I have been told this may be a depot rifle. Any info would be appreciated.
 

Attachments

  • C2B99AA9-B5E7-476C-873F-D77982DCC45B.jpg
    C2B99AA9-B5E7-476C-873F-D77982DCC45B.jpg
    386.4 KB · Views: 51
  • 6F25C56F-F22F-47D0-9226-8E9C79C1DBDF.jpg
    6F25C56F-F22F-47D0-9226-8E9C79C1DBDF.jpg
    333.1 KB · Views: 72
  • 4B920422-BA1F-4084-B7CD-E4B93369BDAC.jpg
    4B920422-BA1F-4084-B7CD-E4B93369BDAC.jpg
    343.9 KB · Views: 48
  • 46AA0497-7599-44AF-9CBB-C8711425AF6A.jpg
    46AA0497-7599-44AF-9CBB-C8711425AF6A.jpg
    381.1 KB · Views: 57
Last edited:

Jbenkert90

Member
I recently got my first k98. It doesn’t have a manufacturer stamp but has several WaA359 markings. Many parts such as barrel, receiver, safety select, floor plate, bolt, and bolt release have matching serial numbers. I have been told this may be a depot rifle. Any info would be appreciated.

Sorry I’m new to this and still trying to figure out how it works. Uploading photos is proving difficult. Should be some now
 

Attachments

  • 8217E940-49F9-47FB-9E7F-ECCEC8C3ECB1.jpg
    8217E940-49F9-47FB-9E7F-ECCEC8C3ECB1.jpg
    320.7 KB · Views: 42
  • B802DA3B-6EBA-4D45-B358-54FAFD012528.jpg
    B802DA3B-6EBA-4D45-B358-54FAFD012528.jpg
    332.4 KB · Views: 37
  • 38666C94-7403-4607-84C9-D03B253AF833.jpg
    38666C94-7403-4607-84C9-D03B253AF833.jpg
    351.7 KB · Views: 52
  • C6AE42A8-E46D-400A-A4ED-D7C500C884EA.jpg
    C6AE42A8-E46D-400A-A4ED-D7C500C884EA.jpg
    386.4 KB · Views: 28
  • 20902912-AD09-40C2-BF7E-1801EB7C0CFC.jpg
    20902912-AD09-40C2-BF7E-1801EB7C0CFC.jpg
    333.1 KB · Views: 40
  • 318B445C-307B-4080-86AA-2A55C6C4946E.jpg
    318B445C-307B-4080-86AA-2A55C6C4946E.jpg
    381.1 KB · Views: 36
  • 29E4AA56-0768-4747-9DE0-944A30CA80AC.jpg
    29E4AA56-0768-4747-9DE0-944A30CA80AC.jpg
    343.9 KB · Views: 27
Last edited:

Warrior1354

ax - hole
Yeap that is a depot rifle the 0,2 marking means the barrel was replaced. They also used a subcontracted Walther made K98k receiver. Please post more pictures.

Does the rifle have any stock markings. You will also need to show pictures of the bolt as well. And some closer pictures of the markings on the left and right side of the receiver area. This will help identity what depot and who did the work.
 

Jbenkert90

Member
Yeap that is a depot rifle the 0,2 marking means the barrel was replaced. They also used a subcontracted Walther made K98k receiver. Please post more pictures.

Does the rifle have any stock markings. You will also need to show pictures of the bolt as well. And some closer pictures of the markings on the left and right side of the receiver area. This will help identity what depot and who did the work.

There are only two markings on the stock that I can find. The markings on the receiver look like Hzala5 I think. I am currently at work so I will have to get some pics of the bolt when I’m home. Does the WaA 359 mean a Walter receiver? Thanks.
 

Attachments

  • F4F154D5-C16B-4F96-852E-568431163C09.jpg
    F4F154D5-C16B-4F96-852E-568431163C09.jpg
    320.7 KB · Views: 37
  • 324B1BDA-8107-4471-A666-8536C9C6C5AD.jpg
    324B1BDA-8107-4471-A666-8536C9C6C5AD.jpg
    332.4 KB · Views: 40

Warrior1354

ax - hole
I will have to go through my books to find out which depot that is. The depot marked K98k rifles are not my main collecting focus. Were still finding out newer information on depot rifles still.

And yes Walther did make K98k receivers. Anyway it looks like a legit K98k depot rifle which are undervalued IMO. Some of these rifles can be sleepers and be had for far less then an all matching factory K98k. The more I study depot rifles the more I like them. They are quite interesting K98k rifles.

Thank you for the pictures and sharing your K98k rifle with is.
 

flynaked

Repo Field Gear Collector
Glad to see this turn up here, couldn’t get a good look at the markings before. This is actually a depot build and not a rework, the 0,2 indicates that the barrel is a spare, they are marked like that before installation. No clue on that depot, hopefully someone knows or hopefully we can figure it out, definitely a new one on me. The stock acceptance is unique too, thanks for posting it.
 

Jbenkert90

Member
I will have to go through my books to find out which depot that is. The depot marked K98k rifles are not my main collecting focus. Were still finding out newer information on depot rifles still.

And yes Walther did make K98k receivers. Anyway it looks like a legit K98k depot rifle which are undervalued IMO. Some of these rifles can be sleepers and be had for far less then an all matching factory K98k. The more I study depot rifles the more I like them. They are quite interesting K98k rifles.

Thank you for the pictures and sharing your K98k rifle with is.

And thank you for all the information. I am excited to have got this for my first one. It definitely makes for a fun shooter
 

Jbenkert90

Member
Glad to see this turn up here, couldn’t get a good look at the markings before. This is actually a depot build and not a rework, the 0,2 indicates that the barrel is a spare, they are marked like that before installation. No clue on that depot, hopefully someone knows or hopefully we can figure it out, definitely a new one on me. The stock acceptance is unique too, thanks for posting it.

I am glad to be getting this info. I wanted one that I could shoot and enjoy, and not do anything with. The depot rifle seems to be intriguing that’s for sure. Thanks again.
 

Loewe

Moderator²
Staff member
While this rifle is unidentifiable at the moment (I am not sure which HZa built it based upon the limited details), it is not alone, attached find a similar rifle, surely made by the same ordnance depot and period.

It should give you some perspective regarding its originality and rarity.
 

Attachments

  • KCNMar96a.jpg
    KCNMar96a.jpg
    311.6 KB · Views: 59
Last edited:

Loewe

Moderator²
Staff member
BTW, what is key is a clear picture of the HZa stamp, see if you can get the sharpest, cleanest, clearest and most distinct picture possible of this eagled acceptance stamp. Look at the FP HZa on the barrel and receiver and if possible the lower buttstock, assuming any are clearly definable. There are numerous lists of the known HZa around, but this one is elusive and as far as i know only the second recorded, neither clear enough to make out the HZa location (HZa followed by a series of letters, typically a upper case letter followed by a lower case letter, - identifies the facility, typically a city or town, followed by a number, the number representing the inspector/armorer or shop (theories vary).

If you haven't gathered by now, not much is really known with certainty, the larger shops are better known, more examples and variations, the mom and pops are less known not only because so few made, but they were not long in existence, - prior to the nazis coming along, there were only three official HZa's, all technically illegal (though kind of like pot being illegal, everyone knew about them, no one really cared enough to get the Germans to move them and change their name, which is all the Germans would have done had they been spotlighted...), naturally once Hitler came along the Germans just just popped up these ordnance shops, as the list of conquest grew, so did the number or shops, so to the distinctions, some real depots, some more temporary (ordnance staffs) or small operations (the police and SS had dozens of shops, who knows how complex each shop was, only lists are known).

In short, if you can get a clear enough picture where we can identify the first upper case letter "after" HZa, we might be able to guess the actual depot. There are a lot of them if you include all the sub-shops and subordinate depots. Probably more than 50, more if you include the specialized shops... this is probably one of the more formal ordnance depots because it is HZa and not HZNa.
 

Jbenkert90

Member
BTW, what is key is a clear picture of the HZa stamp, see if you can get the sharpest, cleanest, clearest and most distinct picture possible of this eagled acceptance stamp. Look at the FP HZa on the barrel and receiver and if possible the lower buttstock, assuming any are clearly definable. There are numerous lists of the known HZa around, but this one is elusive and as far as i know only the second recorded, neither clear enough to make out the HZa location (HZa followed by a series of letters, typically a upper case letter followed by a lower case letter, - identifies the facility, typically a city or town, followed by a number, the number representing the inspector/armorer or shop (theories vary).

If you haven't gathered by now, not much is really known with certainty, the larger shops are better known, more examples and variations, the mom and pops are less known not only because so few made, but they were not long in existence, - prior to the nazis coming along, there were only three official HZa's, all technically illegal (though kind of like pot being illegal, everyone knew about them, no one really cared enough to get the Germans to move them and change their name, which is all the Germans would have done had they been spotlighted...), naturally once Hitler came along the Germans just just popped up these ordnance shops, as the list of conquest grew, so did the number or shops, so to the distinctions, some real depots, some more temporary (ordnance staffs) or small operations (the police and SS had dozens of shops, who knows how complex each shop was, only lists are known).

In short, if you can get a clear enough picture where we can identify the first upper case letter "after" HZa, we might be able to guess the actual depot. There are a lot of them if you include all the sub-shops and subordinate depots. Probably more than 50, more if you include the specialized shops... this is probably one of the more formal ordnance depots because it is HZa and not HZNa.


Wow now that is some in depth information. Thank you. So here are some pictures of the stamp. These are about as clear as I can get. It looks like the beginning letter is Z not an H, maybe missing from the stamp?
 

Attachments

  • FA230185-45CC-434C-8849-43C5010BF79A.jpg
    FA230185-45CC-434C-8849-43C5010BF79A.jpg
    383.7 KB · Views: 37
  • 7942B06D-2CD2-45AB-A178-DA70A35DF617.jpg
    7942B06D-2CD2-45AB-A178-DA70A35DF617.jpg
    385.9 KB · Views: 37
Last edited:

Jbenkert90

Member
Yeap that is a depot rifle the 0,2 marking means the barrel was replaced. They also used a subcontracted Walther made K98k receiver. Please post more pictures.

Does the rifle have any stock markings. You will also need to show pictures of the bolt as well. And some closer pictures of the markings on the left and right side of the receiver area. This will help identity what depot and who did the work.

I can only find two markings on the stock. Her are those and some of the bolt and receiver markings
 

Attachments

  • 2E91089D-DA97-46D8-B4E6-29F4A260D83C.jpg
    2E91089D-DA97-46D8-B4E6-29F4A260D83C.jpg
    320.7 KB · Views: 24
  • 06F1BDD8-9C73-452C-BAD9-74043B3A814A.jpg
    06F1BDD8-9C73-452C-BAD9-74043B3A814A.jpg
    332.4 KB · Views: 24
  • 0D00CE60-5C07-4171-A54B-286A41580F21.jpg
    0D00CE60-5C07-4171-A54B-286A41580F21.jpg
    385.9 KB · Views: 28
  • 22F12041-AF46-4760-8DCB-27210CD12366.jpg
    22F12041-AF46-4760-8DCB-27210CD12366.jpg
    383.7 KB · Views: 26
  • 42135D98-52B2-4904-A1CE-C18F01909683.jpg
    42135D98-52B2-4904-A1CE-C18F01909683.jpg
    363.5 KB · Views: 28
  • 82499108-D12A-4B7A-8649-1DBF608DD1C0.jpg
    82499108-D12A-4B7A-8649-1DBF608DD1C0.jpg
    302.6 KB · Views: 24
  • 44C36819-61A0-427E-8566-2C736E486714.jpg
    44C36819-61A0-427E-8566-2C736E486714.jpg
    369.9 KB · Views: 25
  • 1ED17E05-30A3-41DB-9C39-DDF11255A170.jpg
    1ED17E05-30A3-41DB-9C39-DDF11255A170.jpg
    359.2 KB · Views: 22
  • 8ED72EBE-DC84-41BA-A294-2AB93AE4559B.jpg
    8ED72EBE-DC84-41BA-A294-2AB93AE4559B.jpg
    304.5 KB · Views: 21
  • 301E27B0-3757-4B17-B2A2-47724C03AB03.jpg
    301E27B0-3757-4B17-B2A2-47724C03AB03.jpg
    387.5 KB · Views: 26
Last edited:

RyanE

Baby Face
Staff member
Good closeups!

Stamp is either worn/broken or simply poor quality, so hard to make out exactly what it says. Could be ZaLa5 (HNZa Lissa) or possibly ZaUa5 (HZa Unna).
 

Doc308

Member
I'm amazed by the knowledge of everyone on here. I too am new to Mauser rifles and my brain can't process all the knowledge that's being shared on here. The more I lurk around, the more I learn. I'm learning quickly thanks to all of you. Keep it up, the history of these is slowly growing farther away.
 

Loewe

Moderator²
Staff member
It's a baffler for sure, - no blame can laid at your feet regarding pictures though... excellent photography.

HZa Unna is certainly a strong possibility, it has the distinction of being the only actual HZa that could be a match, there are subordinate inspectorate that could also be a match, Lodz operated under Wehrkreis XXI, though I doubt this is it, for one it is unclear what they did exactly (listed as a subordinate armaments command, Lodz was once an ordnance staff, so this is possibly some storage and repair shop later in the war?), second your inspection suggests a full HZa is responsible, plus Unna is known to have supplied the western front almost exclusively, whereas Lodz certainly faced east.. there are other remote possibilities, - and some are a lot more remote than others, especially if we get to the smaller ordnance shops which give no details to operations.

As Ryan stated, the die looks damaged or at least unevenly struck, so we can only guess at possibilities. The good is that very few seem to be a plausible match and Unna is probably the best guess with the pictures available. The fact that the two known examples are in such great shape suggest bringbacks, which also point to an western HZa origin, which Unna certainly fits. Further, that Wehrkeis VI doesn't seem to have made/built rifles might also suggest this is how they marked the ones they made, - the vast majority of Wehrkreis built rifles and serialed them with their numeric designation before each serial number, that VI isn't known to have done this may suggest this is their variation of the program.

*** That every Wehrkreis around VI is known to have built rifles makes one wonder why Wehrkries VI didn't, while it is true Wehrkreis X are rare, it is also true that Wehrkreis IX made quite a few and used a unique pattern. This suggests that each Wehrkreis had some latitude to how and whether they built them, or how many, - I think this could be how Wehrkreis VI built and marked them if Ryan is right with HZa Unna as the maker.
 

Jbenkert90

Member
I'm amazed by the knowledge of everyone on here. I too am new to Mauser rifles and my brain can't process all the knowledge that's being shared on here. The more I lurk around, the more I learn. I'm learning quickly thanks to all of you. Keep it up, the history of these is slowly growing farther away.

Well said, I couldn’t agree more.
 

Jbenkert90

Member
Good closeups!

Stamp is either worn/broken or simply poor quality, so hard to make out exactly what it says. Could be ZaLa5 (HNZa Lissa) or possibly ZaUa5 (HZa Unna).

Thanks for the information. Every piece is interesting to me, just trying to imagine the story of their rifle. The photography compliment is also appreciated lol.
 

Military Rifle Journal
Top