IX 43 depot rifle

ffeng31

ffeng31

Active member
IX 43 depot rifle...Now with new pics !!

Good day to all. New member here with a few questions. I have acquired an IX 43 depot built/repaired K98. What little I can find suggests that most examples of these that have surfaced have been RC. Mine appears to be a very early import and seems to have escaped the wrath of the Russians and there rebuild techniques. Maybe an import from another country??? Here are a few pics from the auction . I will be more than happy to post better when it arrives at my door. Thanks in advance for any and all comments.
 

Attachments

  • pix126183866.jpg
    pix126183866.jpg
    37.8 KB · Views: 166
  • pix000819541.jpg
    pix000819541.jpg
    46.9 KB · Views: 200
  • pix909237093.jpg
    pix909237093.jpg
    47.2 KB · Views: 162
  • pix792626462.jpg
    pix792626462.jpg
    42.3 KB · Views: 155
  • pix659355193.jpg
    pix659355193.jpg
    57 KB · Views: 171
  • pix434538492.jpg
    pix434538492.jpg
    36.1 KB · Views: 169
Last edited:
It looks like a RC to me but I could be wrong.

The bolt was added and is Steyr.
I sure could use that floor plate :thumbsup:


..
 
I was under the impression that the RC's underwent a rearsenal that included re-bluing/shellac/renumbering(electropenciling) and the like. This rifle doesn't appear to have been subjected to that. That was the only reason I presumed it may have been an import for somewhere else. What is it about the floorplate that appeals to you??
 
Some RC's have been known to slip through without being rebuilt. I have seen them with mismatched bolts (otherwise matching) and have recently heard of one with a factory matched bolt. However, the rifle you have purchased is likely not still wearing most of its Russian-added parts. It appears to have a Yugoslavian renumbered stock. Chances are someone added the armourer-type unnumbered floorplate because it was Astrawerke marked like the receiver. I am guessing that whoever originally purchased this one swapped parts to make it look more presentable.
 
Pisgah said:
Some RC's have been known to slip through without being rebuilt. I have seen them with mismatched bolts (otherwise matching) and have recently heard of one with a factory matched bolt. .
Click to expand...


I've never seen anyone post pictures of a matching "RC". I have bolt m/m albanain imports but I don't consider them the same even though one had the RC x...

..
 
Probably 5-10 years ago I vaguely remember hearing of 1-2 RC's which were basically bolt mismatches. Someone claimed they had one or had seen one with an original matching bolt (I don't think completely matching, just a matching bolt) on one of the boards in the last several weeks. I had one with a mismatched but self-matching and non-refinished bolt once. I am sure that 99% plus of them them are near complete mismatches with EP'ed numbers like we usually see.
 
This one was sold in January 2004 by "relichunter", not sure if it is an rc but it looks like one. (text below)

There are a couple that look like they might be older imports, not rc, but I have two pictures of each and hard to tell much about their condition. Very worn rifles anyway. The only rifle that is known that might be worth a damn was owned by Noel Schott, he got it from Springfield Sporters owner long ago apparently. He wrote briefly about it in the MRJ (1998). Since he passed no telling where it is now, I am not sure even who handled his estate, but BobJ might know.

I would like to see it, hopefully one day we will.

This is belived to be a"POSSIBLE",maybe Military District rifle..I don't have any data/info too examine and so the lack of resource reference material will automatically lead to a controversy..Even Backbone of the Wehrmacht,on page 21 ,pic 25,we see R.Law carefully choose his words.."SUPPOSEDLY denoting issue to the Twenty First military district"..R.Law was carefull Too present what was Know and verified..Admitting that there was more to learn and that there were exceaptions too what was known to date , as evidenced on page 74 ,pic 75..I QUOTE "Just as there are rules ,so there are exceaptions"..My email over this pc., is all over the spectrum..All of them I belive too be sound reasoning ,BUT all ,as was R.Laws book ,based on there own limited information..She has only 3 digit serial number and I have only heard of 2 others in 3o years,serial numbers are not available to me,so it is impossible to estimate serial number range..Very good eagles with swazs,are seen on barrel and receiver..BORE is bright shinny with a shade,and maybe a tiny tiny frost,that may be barely seen..SO BORE IS GOOD, NO PITS ,NONE..Stock is walnut..Stock and handhaurd are sound , NO CRACKS or large gouges,NONE..stock has oridinary small scratches and ding..Stock has an import serial number found on left side.. German Stock proof is on right side..Both are seen in pics..she has old CAI import stamp,which is tiny and neat,on barrel..HEADSPACE is VERY GOOD,she will NOT close on the "NO GO GAUGE"..Acceapts Go gauge..PLease use the many pics,of different angles and lighting for more detail..ALL LAWS apply,ship to FFL,or C+R license..ship/insure/pack is 18.00 ,reg UPS or 23 .00 for faster..I prefer MO for speed but check is OK if patient..See other auctions ..Caliber is 8X57 mauser
Information added 01/19/2004 10:06:40 AM:
WAFS , Starting with Bayonet lug,nothing is on front of bayo lug..FRONT Band ,NO waf,only serial number 9242..Rear BAND "214" waf and serial number 698..Right side of barrel at base of rear sight,is "26" "26",at least 90% crisp..Rear sight ladder is "358" "358",with serial number 8921..Rear sight slide is blank,nothing..Rear sight Base is "623" ,with serial number 9971..Barrel has what is seen in the pictures ,as well as not seen ,are Waf "623" ,only the "62" is seen ,but obvioussly with the tip of a 3..Barrel root has "7.91" ,and a "2" with a "star burst" of some kind over the 2..Recoil lug has Waf "26"..Extractor Box has waf "655" and serial 88..trigger gaurd has wafs "280" "280",with serial number 3843..Magazine floor plate has waf large "1" and waf small "1" with wings,no serial number..Both sides of take down disks,have NO wafs ,nothing..Butt plate is blued over,no serial number or wafs,nothing..Left side of stock has serial number, OBVIOUSSLY having been somewhere else then just Germany..Then on right side of stock,a NICE proof of "135",with a full eagle above with full swaz..This is the only proof ,no other eagle stock proofs were struck.. there is no goast ,there is no sanding,only one stock proof was stuck..Back too left side of stock ,between the recoil lug and sling cut out is a circle with letters BK or BH or something like that..in front of,Front sight base has waf "37"..Right side of receiver has Wafs ,large"1" then small "1" with wings..Bolt has matching numbers on handle,shroud,safty..Wafs seen on theses 3 pcs of bolt are "77".. Cocking pc dose NOT match and has waf "63"..




I X 43 German WW2 K98k mauser Military District
Item #15189387
If you have questions about this item, please contact the Seller by clicking on the seller's user name below. The Seller assumes all responsibility for this item listing.
Seller: ​
 relichunter1 A+(130)
Auction ends: ​
 01/31/2004 2:35:21 PM (US Eastern time)
Auction started: ​
 01/17/2004 2:35:21 PM (US Eastern time)
Starting Bid was: ​
 $840.00
Current Bid is: ​
 $0.00
Minimum bid for this item: ​
 $840.00
Number of bids placed: ​
 - (may include bids placed by AutoBid)
 
I think I will withhold judgement on the parts swapping ,"to make it more presentable", theory until I have the rifle in my hands. And even then there will be no way to verify with what parts it arrived here wearing. From what I have read original (read non-RC) examples of these IX43 rifles havent been seen very often, if at all. That being the case , I would think that even a mixmaster like this one would be fairly sought after.
 
SimsonSuhl , It would appear that my rifle is very similar to the one in this old auction. Well , RC or not , its mine now and I am happy with it. At the very least it is a great conversation piece. I didnt pay all that much for it and if turns out to have some unique history then all the better. Seeing that these raise alot of question, I will be more than happy to subject it to examination if anyone desires . I will at the very least see what matches on it and what doesnt , and post up some more and better pics.
 
The rifle is the "exact" same rifle, same serial number, same barrel code and the random marks (like at the woodline below receiver fireproof) are identical.

Yes, they are good for conversation, and better pictures of your rifle might reveal something new. Only 7 or 8 are known, and a couple other reports. Only a couple are fully documented and as they are soviet reworks, they do not offer very much information due to the fact only the barrel, receiver and rear sight sleeve are original.

ffeng31 said:
SimsonSuhl , It would appear that my rifle is very similar to the one in this old auction. Well , RC or not , its mine now and I am happy with it. At the very least it is a great conversation piece. I didnt pay all that much for it and if turns out to have some unique history then all the better. Seeing that these raise alot of question, I will be more than happy to subject it to examination if anyone desires . I will at the very least see what matches on it and what doesnt , and post up some more and better pics.
Click to expand...
 

Attachments

  • 1.jpg
    1.jpg
    42.8 KB · Views: 88
Thank you for the information. Remarkable that it is the same rifle. When it arrives ,I will most assuredly take the best pics I can and post them up for evaluation.
 
ffeng31 said:
I didnt pay all that much for it and if turns out to have some unique history then all the better.
Click to expand...

You didn't pay much? How much was it? If it sold for $840 on 2004, and you paid (presumably) a lot less, who took the big loss? Was the rifle online, or someone you know?

Yes, please do post pics of everything. Very cool rifle no matter what! This is one example of an RC I'd pay more for, for sure.

I'll get my external harddrive up, I think I may have several images of these, wasn't this one (and others) on the photo CD from way back (2005 or so?)

Ceiling cat sees all auctions, past, present, and future....
 

Attachments

  • cieling cat.png
    cieling cat.png
    68.4 KB · Views: 20
I am not sure if it sold for $840 back then, I didn't follow it, but back then we (I) wasn't so sure of it's authenticity. These do not follow the typical HZa depot builds of 1941-1942, it has many similarities but several things are different.

Since then we (I) believe they are authentic HZa builds, BruceK apparently knew of one, NoelS, and others have accepted them for what they are. Plus some have shown up in Europe, and it isn't too likely someone is taking Astrawerke ordnance spares, and ordnance spare barrels to make up HZa "rc" for the small premium they might achieve over a regular rc.

Anyway, it might be on the disk from back then, but I have the pictures and can post them if interested. They are no more revealing than these, - actually these are better.

I also agree that someone is always "watching" these days. You use to be able to get by with passing rifles you enhanced, not today. There are many people out there that do what I have been doing since 1999 or so, capturing data from all sources for a database. My interest is mainly to trend out patterns of production, sub-contracting, and reworking patterns (what is typical for each depot-ordnance staff) but a lot of people do it today for other reasons.

ditch68 said:
You didn't pay much? How much was it? If it sold for $840 on 2004, and you paid (presumably) a lot less, who took the big loss? Was the rifle online, or someone you know?

Yes, please do post pics of everything. Very cool rifle no matter what! This is one example of an RC I'd pay more for, for sure.

I'll get my external harddrive up, I think I may have several images of these, wasn't this one (and others) on the photo CD from way back (2005 or so?)

Ceiling cat sees all auctions, past, present, and future....
Click to expand...
 
IX Wehrkriese Coded K98

Paul, that IX was documented as far back as the Armstrong short guide to the K98k and thats going way back.
IMO, they are legit, and possibly the neatest of the depot assembled rifles.

Wish we could find a decent nearly original rifle, even bolt mm in original trim would be nice.

What is the extent of the serial range from the Kassel HzA ?

B.
 
I have that old pamphlet somewhere.. can't find it though. I think it is in an old book, but I will find it later and check it out!

3340 is the highest I have recorded. I agree, an original rifle would be very helpful!

bruce98k said:
Paul, that IX was documented as far back as the Armstrong short guide to the K98k and thats going way back.
IMO, they are legit, and possibly the neatest of the depot assembled rifles.

Wish we could find a decent nearly original rifle, even bolt mm in original trim would be nice.

What is the extent of the serial range from the Kassel HzA ?

B.
Click to expand...
 
Well I guess the cat is out of the bag . $ 465 was the purchase price. I consider myself very fortunate to have won it . I had to stay up late to bid and it helped that the listing was somewhat obscure. It was listed as a Kar98K , and hence did not show if you simply searched for K98's.
 
That rifle was discussed on at least one other site while the auction was ongoing.

People thought it was interesting but wouldn't part with the $499 to bid on it.
 
Last edited:
Well then I'll just consider myself lucky. :thumbsup: Some would balk at paying that much for a mismatched rifle. I on the other hand , with what I have learned of it , am quite content with my purchase.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top