Training to ID Turds : 660 1940 3738

Training to ID Turds : 660 1940 3738


The goal of the Turd Alert Protection System (“TAPS”) has been to protect and foster integrity in the hobby. This is accomplished by: 1) protecting new collectors from getting ripped off and educating them by outing turds; and 2) making sellers accountable for what they monger.

What we see in the Gunbonker awkshun above is IMHO evidence of the returns on our TAPS system. The seller here actually (albeit euphemistically) points out the problems with this rifle. IMHO, it was turded up to deceive originally and likely left skidmarks on some folks. However, at least this seller is not trying to carnival bark this one. It’s a classic example of a “resurrected” sporter humped back to “original” condition with a poorly humped stock, bands, buttplate, and bayonet lug.

Any of you guys who have questions about why, please do post pics of what you have questions about.

For the most part, the add text is what I would expect if the rifle was selling on the trader here.

Hambone said:

Training to ID Turds : 660 1940 3738

https://www.gunbroker.com/Item/1105739507

The goal of the Turd Alert Protection System (“TAPS”) has been to protect and foster integrity in the hobby. This is accomplished by: 1) protecting new collectors from getting ripped off and educating them by outing turds; and 2) making sellers accountable for what they monger.

What we see in the Gunbonker awkshun above is IMHO evidence of the returns on our TAPS system. The seller here actually (albeit euphemistically) points out the problems with this rifle. IMHO, it was turded up to deceive originally and likely left skidmarks on some folks. However, at least this seller is not trying to carnival bark this one. It’s a classic example of a “resurrected” sporter humped back to “original” condition with a poorly humped stock, bands, buttplate, and bayonet lug.

Any of you guys who have questions about why, please do post pics of what you have questions about.

Click to expand...

interesting seller, his listing for a Mauser HSc is similarly not full of exaggerations, overstatements & hyperbole, might have to ‘save this seller’……..

mauser202 said:

For the most part, the add text is what I would expect if the rifle was selling on the trader here.

Click to expand...

Yeah looks like an honest seller who got burned.

Also as much as I appreciate looking at guns like this from an educational standpoint (god knows I don’t catch the better fakes myself often enough) I thought we dont do active auctions?

If they are a TA, they are fair game, lLive auction posts for a legit item are not.

Pretty sure Ive bought from this seller in the past. Seems like a pretty upfront and honest description, which is appreciated in this day and age

Cyrano4747 said:

Yeah looks like an honest seller who got burned.

Also as much as I appreciate looking at guns like this from an educational standpoint (god knows I don’t catch the better fakes myself often enough) I thought we dont do active auctions?

Click to expand...

The exception is and always has been that ongoing auctions may be posted for turd alert purposes. Such exception is necessary to warn, protect, and educate. That is the case here. The seller does appropriately ID the problems.

Muncher 1953 said:

interesting seller, his listing for a Mauser HSc is similarly not full of exaggerations, overstatements & hyperbole, might have to ‘save this seller’……..

Click to expand...

Yes, as it should be for such things. It appears that some sellers (not this one obviously) like to sell for inflated and exaggerated prices by claiming expertise through their descriptions. One can’t claim expertise for profits and then claim the lack thereof to avoid culpability for fakery, IMHO.

The seller here gets a nod for candor and honesty in the description.

Since we're using this as a learning aid, I'll start the ball rolling with the bands. Here's the auction photo from the turd:




Things to note off the top: The front band has a flat/dished spot that is visible in the photograph from where it was ground to remove the old SN. I also see a bit of what I assume is the same around the "8" in the front band. More critically, however, the number size and font is wrong. The font in particular is apparent if you look at the good small parts on the rifle. Thank god for the number 3. In the humped parts the 3 has a curved top. In the legit parts it has a flat top, as seen on the trigger guard:



That is the most obvious tell. The 7 is also pretty obviously wrong. The 8 is more subtle, but if you look at the relative size of the top and bottom loops it's also bad. The stamping isn't horrible, I've seen far worse, but the font is a dead give away.

Now here are two bands from a good rifle courtesy of the picture index here. Note the size of the numbers and the placement. If you compare them to the humped parts it's pretty apparent, especially with the front band.



I'll also note that the turd's bands have wear patterns that are inconsistent with the rest of the gun ,even given it's likely partially refinished status. Much too dark, much too consistent, no where near enough wear especially around high points like the edges of the front band. Compare that to the good band above. Grinding a number off isn't exactly gentle to a finish so they had to do a full polish and refinish on those parts. Even absent everything else that alone is enough to make you stop and look really hard at the rest of the gun - why refinish only the bands? Answer: you don't. Something else is going on even if you don't know enough to check the SNs or don't spot the issues.

Here's one I'll throw out the the more knowledgeable posters here. The seller posted this: "The metal has had the finish refreshed on all the parts as well and a little spotty. My guess is it was dipped without buffing so parts that had wear look different than those that had little or no wear. "

Now, looking at the finish on the receiver and barrel there's absolutely something fishy about it, but I can't quite articulate it or put my finger on it. Any idea what's going on here? Or is he just cluing into the total refinish on the bands?