Can someone tell me what I have?

C

copperking81

Member
My dad bought this bayonet ~30 years ago. I don't know much about it but am hoping you guys can fill me in. I believe we were told it was a youth bayonet.

Dad passed on years ago and the bayonet is now in my possession and will remain so regardless of what it is or it's value but I am curious about those details.

Thanks in advance!
 

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capt14k said:
I think it is a reproduction Hitler Youth Dress Bayonet.

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What about it makes you say it's reproduction? And what would the intent of a the reproduction market be? i.e. is it actually intended for reenactors or frauding collectors?
 
People make reproductions for many reasons, usually to defraud. I don't know enough about them but the emblem doesn't look real.
 
mrfarb said:
People make reproductions for many reasons, usually to defraud. I don't know enough about them but the emblem doesn't look real.
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I agree, the emblem has always struck me as not quite right. And I don't even know what I'm looking for. I don't recall what we paid but I don't think it was all that much so a reproduction wouldn't surprise me.

I guess I'm just surprised that people who...1) are knowledgeable about WWII German gear, 2) have the equipment and skill to repro that gear, 3) the time to do it, and 4) recognized and found a sizeable market for it... actually got into the business of producing this stuff.
 
copperking81 said:
..at would the intent of a the reproduction market be? i.e. is it actually intended for reenactors or frauding collectors?
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So I'll say this. I agree with Mike in that the emblem and more so it's mounting does not look to be 3rd Reich standards. Just my $.02 as I know Jack about these. However several older and much wiser than I collectors have said many times stuff was being faked (especially SS) since the war ended. Story and reasoning goes is there was only so much to be had yet the bring back demand was SO great among return GIs they immediately started making or remaking these items for sale to said GIs. Same goes for the cigarette rifles. Cobbled together as semi-custom souvenir or hunting rifles out of left over K98k parts by small gunsmiths to meet the same demands. Makes perfect sense actually.
 
The handle and the swastika emblem looks very similar to a Hitler Youth knife (even though this is a bayonet), and I know that folks have been faking those for quite a while. If you tap the emblem, real ones should move just the slightest bit, due the way it was assembled. This is an informative Youtube vid that shows both real and fake Hitler Youth knives:
https://youtu.be/07kW4_o_NVM
 
copperking81 said:
What about it makes you say it's reproduction? And what would the intent of a the reproduction market be? i.e. is it actually intended for reenactors or frauding collectors?
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Basically what was said already. Some are made and sold as reproductions so people can have an example without laying out a bunch of money. Some are made as counterfeits and sold as real to try and screw people. Sometimes reproductions are sold as the real thing because people don't know any better, and sometimes because people are scumbags. Someone with more knowledge I'm sure can tell you definitively if it is original or not.

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To me, it looks like some one took a KS98 short version by Puma, carved out a place in the grip and placed an HJ diamond in it. The workmanship where the grip was cut out for the diamond is crap. The KS98 is (or was) good. Can not say if the HJ diamond is real or not. HJ not my thing (yet).

Went over to the Hitler Youth Militaria Collector forum to check on an HJ bayonet. There is a thread back in 2016 showing a KS98 long version with an HJ diamond placed in the grip like yours. The cut out for the HJ diamond was done very good on that one, but it is still BS. They say there is no such thing as an HJ bayonet. Would be a fantasy piece. Those guys there are the way about HJ stuff that the guys here are about K98s.

As a side thought, all of the " Hitler Youth bayonets" that are pictured, including yours, have different maker marks. That seems odd these "rare" (4 or 5) bayonets that I know of, all are made by different makers. I know HJ knives have a multitude (over 100) of makers and as such, if these HJ bayos were real and produced by more than one maker , you would think there would be more of them
 
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Maybe better photos could help on this, but the finish looks like chrome on metall parts, from details of grip rivets,pommel it could be a possibility the piece is already postwar production, but i am not expert in KS98.
 

I would agree to grimlin13, the Extra-KS98 is original, made by Puma/Lauterjung & sons.
You should check the handle if its made of steel, which I would assume.
If yes, it´s made somewhere between 1930 - 1938, because of the birdhead handle, and the early scabbard.
The Hitler-Youth emblem is not original and was added later, in my opinion.
It was fixed with glue, which is allways a no go for such items.
To bad, that someone destroyed it.
 
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