S84/98 Ersatz belt frog

[magicroyuk]

I purchased a reissued S84/98 bayonet stamped 1920 with this this belt frog a very long time ago.

In my opinion genuine examples in good condition are very rare due to the fragile nature of their construction.
When worn and hanging on the belt with the bayonet, the thin nature of the leather front section can crack & split, with this type of coarse material the metal rivets can easily degrade over the years and pull through the canvas.

A really lucky find.

 

[pwcosol]

I agree. The ersatz "breadbag" cloth & leather frog is a desirable one to have. These did not stand up well to usage in the field. There is also another interesting aspect to this frog. From my own observations and those of others, this frog is the only one which has a direct association, (but not an exclusive one) with a specific S84/98 T3. The bayonet is the last pattern A.W.S. commercial. Their trademark is a set of scales with the "A" at 9:00, "W" at 3:00 and "S" at 6:00. To the right of this marking is the "Alcoso Solingen" surcharge. The marking appears on the bayonet's ricasso. The bayonet typically exhibits a moderate machined surface with a dull blue finish, as does scabbard. Grips are red phenolic composite or wood. I have recorded almost a dozen examples of the breadbag frog found mated with this bayonet and several were verified as direct vet purchased items. The breadbag frog has been seen on a few of the late "blanko" commercial S84/98 T3s (attributable to both Horster and Eickhorn) as well. This stands to reason, as the thin material and construction of the frog would never meet Heer specifications.

 

[AndyB]

I personally disagree with AWS means a A.W.Schulte, more real its firm variation name of Alcoso Werk Solingen as not possible use the jewish old name Alexander Coppel in NS time.b.r.Andy

 

[pwcosol]

I personally disagree with AWS means a A.W.Schulte, more real its firm variation name of Alcoso Werk Solingen as not possible use the Jewish old name Alexander Coppel in NS time.b.r.Andy

Andy:
Yes, now that I think about it, I recall this discussion taking place some years ago. So, I looked up the firm in Anthony Carter's The Sword & Knife Makers of Germany 1850-2000. Carter's excellent biography of the Coppel firm until their dissolution in 1956 supports your argument and I stand corrected. Much appreciated!

 

[magicroyuk]

I agree, it's a great reference work!