Imperial KS98 Hilted Long Blade Prototype

[bruce98k]

This one is a real eye opener. I don't know if any others exist and it is certainly a trials or prototype example.
No maker mark with just a single acceptance stamp on the rear mortice slot.
Now held in a friends collection.

Appreciate any insight into this unique blade.

 

[grimlin13]

That is something to look at for sure. Looking forward in seeing what some of the thoughts are on it. Thanks for posting Bruce.

 

[AndyB]

Certainly interesting piece, it could be one of the prototypes for Marine Boardcutlass, that ended in S98/05 form, the inspector stamp should be compared to made a date estimate, evidently was proofed the dimmension of slot. It could be one of the trial bayonets. Never accepted. Around 1909 they made some trials with similar sawbacked blades. Should be looked to literature. Looks like screws are proofed too, maybe the crossguard and scabbard should be looked for additional stamps.
I found the piece is already in Vial and Mery pictured in reworked trial version, its second version of trial for Cavalry testing of KS98 in 1909, later accepted bayonets were made at Erfurt and fully accepted, by interest i will send You email. I talked with the author of the article J.Wiesberger. Should have 43cm long blade.

 

[bruce98k]

Andy would appreciate any additional via email. Can you post any images from the refereced texts?

 

[bruce98k]

Verified 43cm blade length

 

[bert.f]

Hello,
The wooden grips thery look replaced.
Between 1905-1908 test were carried out with the ks 98, deifferent blade and handle variants .
AN Kulinski " World Bayonets " volume I , page 405, nr 373, .... handle bracket, leather grip shells riveted three , blade length 433 mm
a scan of book cover an Kulinski Volume II, probably that bayonet ?

 

[AndyB]

No, in article of Mr.W. occured that only unrealised trial pieces of 1909 have 3 rivets in handle, the real marked and proofed samples are accepted in 1909 and are Erfurt marked, it was equiped originally with wooden grips and 2 screws. All trial pieces have removed the handguard from grip. He corespond with Kulinskij directly in of Museum Petrohrad . But what is important he had original german trial regulations from archives.

 

[AndyB]

There was one piece on Gunboard presented in 2017, evidently with no sign of 3 rivet holes, only with 2 screws and trial 1909 were realised wout handguard. This sample was with 43cm sawbacked blade.

 

[Jackson]

Simply amazing find!

This is recorded in my kS98 book as the 5th version of the 1908/09 Cavalry trial kS98. Several wood grip examples exist in collections but until now they have all had their hand guard removed (one such example is shown on page 148) presumably for issue to infantry pioneers after the trials were unsuccessful. One has a Guard Pionier unit marking. All these examples are stamped Erfurt W09.

To my knowledge, this is the only known wood grip example with its hand guard intact - not even in the Artillery Museum in St Petersberg!

As noted, there is an excellent article (written in German) about this model by Jens Wiesberger
Wiesberger, J. (2017) Die kurzen Seitengewehre 98 für Kavallerie im Truppenversuch 1909. Zeitschrift für Heereskunde, 465: 149-153.

If I ever make a revised edition of the kS98 book I would love to be able to include photos of this exceptional bayonet. Can you put me in touch Bruce?

Many thanks to Nate for tipping me off about this post.

Ian Jackson

Imperial German bayonets

www.imperial-german-bayonets.net

 

[bruce98k]

Ian, Rick and I would be glad to help out in any way!
Just let us know what you need.

This bayonet was originally purchased at an auction in Carrollton Ohio nearly 15 years ago by an unknown buyer.
I was bidding on the item as well but stopped at 900.00US.

Little did I know at the time what this rare beauty was. Some years later the owner sold it at a loss to an antique dealer for
the sum of 300.00US, taking a huge loss. To this day I cant figure that out.
About 3 years ago a friend purchased it from the dealer and this year I arranged a deal for the blade.
It is now held in a collection of a good friend and fellow forum member.

 

[Rhind64]

Wow! Absolutely incredible! Now I wish I would have not been lazy and put up a post on it before now. Thank you very much Bruce for finding this exquisite blade and for facilitating my purchase of it. I remember you and I sitting down discussing exactly what this bayonet could be not knowing what historical significance that it holds! I spent alot of time inspecting this piece and am still in awe of the craftsmanship displayed in its construction. The tight fit of the "D" guard into the pommel is virtually seamless! Thank you very much to everyone who posted with information on this piece!
Andy, Thank you very much for your insight and knowledge! You were the first person I thought of that would know what we have here!
Ian, Very grateful and thank you coming in with the information and research needed to properly ID this bayonet. I really appreciate it. As Bruce stated he and I are standing by with anything needed from you! This bayonet resides in my collection and can I get detained pictures very quickly and easily! In fact if anyone would like to see other pics of it in this post just say the word and I'll be happy to put them up!
Actually today I have it out right now going over it for any additional marks possibly missed. haha
This bayonet is definitely going to be the centerpiece of my Imperial collection!

Thanks Bruce for coming down and photographing it and posting it up!

Rick Hinderer

 

[AndyB]

Thanks for sharing this excellent piece of bayonet history.

 

[AndyB]

There are inspector proofs on screws and countersunk, You should look at crossguard front side under edge of blade.Similar proofs could be on press button, or on locking lug, by pressing it, on protruding side. On scabbards could be proofs on ball finial, mouth, and hook area. Blade and scabbard and metal parts should be oiled. to stop the rusting process.

 

[Rhind64]

You are very welcome Andy! upon further inspection I have found the numbers 48 on the latch, and a inspection stamp on the ball finale. I will continue searching! Also I have oiled it thoroughly to help stop the oxidation process. This is certainly a very cool piece!

Rick

 

[grimlin13]

Very interesting.

Treasures still to be found and more to learn. Great information all.

 

[Jackson]

Hello Rick
The 48 on the latch will be the assembly number. This number would also be placed on the tang underneath the grips and on the grips themselves but please dont attempt to unscrew the bolts! The assembly numbers were used by workmen to keep all the parts together for each bayonet as it was hand fitted. This could mean that at least 48 of these bayonets were made.
For your interest, I have posted here a picture from the kS98 book showing what happened to the great majority of these bayonets. Hand grip removed and pommel filled in (bayonet on the right of the picture).
Amazing find and, yes, certainly the centre-piece of almost any Imperial German bayonet collection!

 

[AndyB]

Yes the 48 should be the assembly number, dont remove the grips as there would be no any additional information. The Jens W. artikel speaks about 150 of accepted pieces of this model
The right picture i assume is presenting the aptiertes SG done post the cavalry trials - he spoke about WW1 using of all avialable bayonets even trials were converted, this would mean a removing of handguard of grip.

 

[Humbarger]

Thanks for sharing.

 

[ljoconnor]

Have never seen one like this one before! Thanks for sharing it!
Larry

 

[Rhind64]

Hello All!
I finally spent some time today photographing this very cool piece of history! The more I handle this bayonet and see the very cool and high quality construction the more amazed I am! Check out the fitting of the hand guard to the "birds beak" pommel! Just incredible! If any of you would like to see a different shot or angle, I will be happy to take it for you! Thanks!

Rick