Interesting stock proof

[Warrior1354]

A friend of my recently purchased a very interesting Weimer 98a. This particular marking is not stamped in the stock, but almost branded into the stock. I personally have never seen these particular markings before. And to top it off, another one surfaced this week with the exact same markings. I wonder if other members here have seen other examples as well. Makes me wonder if these are markings for another paramilitary organization in Germany at that time.

 

[biggymu]

Isn’t that interesting that both should appear in a week. I’ve not seen these before. Wonder if Paul has.

 

[Warrior1354]

Wonder if it's a weapon belonging to one of the communist paramilitary groups in Weimer Germany. One of the symbols looks like a small hammer.

 

[Stan]

I wonder if they are Arabic, or some other Middle Eastern letters?

 

[biggymu]

Thats my first thought. They don’t resemble letters or numerals.

 

[Loewe]

Wonder if it's a weapon belonging to one of the communist paramilitary groups in Weimer Germany. One of the symbols looks like a small hammer.

I wish we had a minuscule amount of knowledge on the KPD (paramilitary) in this time frame, but I doubt they would be so bold as to apply "property" marks to a rifle as they believed in communism, though a rather nationalistic version (one of the frauds of communism as the world has so far experienced, is it is international in view, a great collective... German communists were as nationalistic as the Stalinist version of communism, - you would be hard-pressed to find evidence of true cosmopolitanism or international solidarity, rather the Stalinist were just as nationalistic as the Czars - i.e. the English staunch opposition as the reds threatened their status in India and the east in general, just like the Czars). The KPD rarely missed an opportunity to defy Moscow.

Anyway, I can't even guess with what is shown, maybe an thorough examination of the rifle will give a clue? It looks like it may be a period applied marking, goodness knows the Germans 1919-1923 were awash in queer organizations and paramilitary groups, but these are more typical among the nationalistic and government associated groups. I doubt the KPD would mark their rifles, they were hardly in a position to recover their "property" short of terror, which is the only consistent thing about socialists and communists.

 

[chrisftk]

I wonder if they are Arabic, or some other Middle Eastern letters?

That thought crossed my mind, it's not Arabic or Persian-- though it does resemble Amharic (Ethiopian) script in passing--- but I think that path would only make sense if we had more context on the rifle.

Anyway, I can't even guess with what is shown, maybe an thorough examination of the rifle will give a clue?

I'm a little late to the party here, but I agree, Paul. Knowing more about both rifles pictured might help go down a particular path. I'm skeptical the marking will be conclusively linked to something, but it might at least allow an educated guess. The fact that the two examples are identical rules out numerals, like a rack number and the fact that it's branded, reminiscent of EWB is very interesting. If I've seen this marking before, I don't remember it. Definitely interesting.

Are the two matching? Imperial trim or Blued bolts? Given how reworked these interwar rifles are usually, it's hard to isolate traits, as we all know.. If they are mixmasters, that might open up Stan/Ricks foreign symbols thought. If it's matching or close to it, I'd feel better about assuming German. I lean German-applied right now.

Anyway, just my 2 cents.

 

[Warrior1354]

One rifle is a Erfurt 1915 98a completely matching, and the owner. Was able to get all the vets info that brought it back. From his daughter. The other one is Amberg 1909 currently posted on gunboards that has a exposed duffle cut. But, it is a mixmatcher. The 1915 Erfurt is the best looking example of the two. I just don't want to share a bunch of pictures of it without the owner's permission.

 

[AndyB]

I had already answered, it could be 2.St. for 2.Stamm Companie to sample, as fireburned its real similar marking was realised by Freikorps or postwar as EWB, or PWB marking.

 

[Warrior1354]

I had already answered, it could be 2.St. for 2.Stamm Companie to sample, as fireburned its real similar marking was realised by Freikorps or postwar as EWB, or PWB marking.

And what makes you think that? Those markings do not look like a number two or the letters S and T to me.

 

[chrisftk]

And what makes you think that? Those markings do not look like a number two or the letters S and T to me.

I can totally see it if you read it with the keel facing up. Hard to say if that's the right direction, but it looks a lot more like a stylized "2.St" than anything else I can imagine at the moment.

 

[Cyrano4747]

View attachment 353680

I can totally see it if you read it with the keel facing up. Hard to say if that's the right direction, but it looks a lot more like a stylized "2.St" than anything else I can imagine at the moment.

My issue with this is that most of the marks you see for unit ID or inventory control are made to be as cleanly legible as possible, not stylized. It doesn’t mean they’re always clean, especially the stuff done on a smaller scale, but they’re not going out of their way to stylize.

There’s some room to talk about home made brands and how legible those are going to get, but this looks a bit beyond that to me.

 

[chrisftk]

My issue with this is that most of the marks you see for unit ID or inventory control are made to be as cleanly legible as possible, not stylized. It doesn’t mean they’re always clean, especially the stuff done on a smaller scale, but they’re not going out of their way to stylize.

There’s some room to talk about home made brands and how legible those are going to get, but this looks a bit beyond that to me.

I think there's plenty of precident for wonky stylized brands...

The as-yet-a-mysetery intertwined BS and KS for starters-- they appear both together and separately (and often on the barrel collar too)



Not to mention the font on the EWB


I

 

[Cyrano4747]

You're right, but something still feels off about those to me. I think it's that they're inconsistently spaced and on slightly different planes. The "2" and the "S" for example aren't quite in line. Compare that to the EWB mark and all the letters are at least on the same plane and the spacing is more or less consistent.

That said, I'm just going off gut takes squinting at pictures on the internet. This is pure conjecture so it's not something I'm going to plant my flag too firmly on. It just feels odd, but then I don't have a better hypothesis.